Oak Ridge, Tennessee



ORAL HISTORY OF PATRICIA (PAT) BAILEY

Interviewed by Don Hunnicutt

Filmed by BBB Communications, LLC.

November 3, 2016

MR. HUNNICUTT: This interview is for the Center for Oak Ridge Oral History. The date is November 3, 2016. I'm Don Hunnicutt, in the studio of BBB Communications, LLC., 170 Randolph Road, Oak Ridge, Tennessee, to take Pat Bailey's oral history about living in Oak Ridge. Pat, please state your maiden name, place of birth, and date.

MRS. BAILEY: My name is Patricia Hensley Bailey. I was born in Fontana Village, North Carolina, on January 8, 1944.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, on your father's side, his name, and place of birth.

MRS. BAILEY: My daddy's name was Edwin Hensley. He was born in Ducktown, Tennessee. He was born on August 19, 1914.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, your mother's maiden name, place of birth, and date.

MRS. BAILEY: Melba Lois Raper, born in Culberson, North Carolina, August 18, 1921.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, on your grandfather's side of the family, do you recall when, where your grandfather was born, and the date, his birth?

MRS. BAILEY: On my father's side?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yes.

MRS. BAILEY: Yes. He was James Herbert Hensley, and he was born in 1904. I don't recall the day. And, he was born in Cherokee County, North Carolina.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What about his wife, your grandmother, on that side?

MRS. BAILEY: Ok, my grandmother, my paternal grandmother, was Bessie Leona Nelson, and she was born in 1883, on May 6, I believe, in 1905, or eight, I'm not certain of that. No, I said 1883, didn't I? In Salt Lake City.

MR. HUNNICUTT: On your mother's side of the family, your grandparents, starting with your father, grandfather.

MRS. BAILEY: His name was William Thomas Raper. He was born in Cherokee County, North Carolina, in 1892. Don't remember the date. His wife, and my grandmother, she was much younger, let's see. She was born in, like, 1904, in Cherokee County. I believe. Her name was Delia ... (laughs) What was her last name?

MR. HUNNICUTT: It'll come to you.

MRS. BAILEY: It will.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: If it does, you just tell me.

MRS. BAILEY: I'll just blurt it out. Ok.

MR. HUNNICUTT: There you go. (laughter) Now, what do you remember about your father's school history?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, he didn't share a whole lot of that, but, he graduated from Murphy High School, Murphy, North Carolina. He immediately went to work ... well, he immediately joined the Army, I believe, immediately. He, in basic training, he threw his shoulder out, and never got to serve, during the war. When he came to Oak Ridge, he started work as a field engineer, or a surveyor, in, in the construction division, I believe, which was early on. Well, it was in '44. They put him through a number of engineering courses at UT [University of Tennessee], and so, he was certified in certain things. He did not have a college degree, but he took some college courses. And ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Tell me about your mother's school history.

MRS. BAILEY: Mother went to a little country school, for her primary grades. Then, she also graduated from Murphy High School, in Murphy, North Carolina. She did not further her education, after that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you have sisters, and brothers?

MRS. BAILEY: I have one brother.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, what is his name?

MRS. BAILEY: Tom, Thomas, Hensley.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, do you recall the place of birth, and date, for him?

MRS. BAILEY: He was born in Oak Ridge, February 19, 1949.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I presume the work in Oak Ridge is what brought your father, and the family, here.

MRS. BAILEY: Yes, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, that would make you how old, when you first came to Oak Ridge?

MRS. BAILEY: They tell me that I was six months old, when we moved to Oak Ridge.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You mean you don't remember?

MRS. BAILEY: I don't remember that. (laughter)

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. Do you recall where the family first lived?

MRS. BAILEY: Yes, we lived in a flattop, on Regent Circle.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, how many bedrooms were in that flattop?

MRS. BAILEY: I think there were two. We had a little white, picket fence around it.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did the family have a car?

MRS. BAILEY: Yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you recall, by being told, I'm sure, that, how the family got its possessions from North Carolina, over here?

MRS. BAILEY: I don't believe they had very many possessions, because, in, in Fontana, where they first lived. Fontana Village, they were in a furnished trailer. I think what they brought with them were just their personal things. They started acquiring when they got here.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You know, the flattops were the same flattops that were used at Fontana Village, for when they built the dam over there.

MRS. BAILEY: Yes, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: They gave, TVA [Tennessee Valley Authority] gave them the plans for them.

MRS. BAILEY: Uh-huh ... but we didn't live in one there. We just lived in one of those little Army trailers…

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: …when I was first born.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, how long did you live in the flattop? Do you remember the address?

MRS. BAILEY: 103 Regent Circle.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah, you said Regent. You remember how long you lived there?

MRS. BAILEY: No, I don't. Pictures would probably tell me, probably until I was about three-years-old.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And then, where did your family move to?

MRS. BAILEY: We moved to Hillside, in one of those big apartment places, that are now going to be torn down.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I think they call those K apartments.

MRS. BAILEY: Is that what they were?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Or L ...

MRS. BAILEY: The controversy over the, the apartments there, that ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Right.

MRS. BAILEY: ... no longer are deemed safe to live in. We lived there very briefly. I think I had my fourth birthday there. Then, we moved to Wainwright, which is behind Highland View School, which is now the Children's Museum. We lived on Wainwright from the time I started school, until the second grade. Then, we moved to a B house, on Everest Circle, off of East Drive. I went to Elm Grove School, for a year and a half.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you remember a thing, anything about your childhood, when you were four-years-old?

MRS. BAILEY: Four-years-old.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Birthday parties ... ?

MRS. BAILEY: I remember birthday parties. I remember, I vividly remember one where everybody was taller than me. I remember, out in front of the big apartment dwelling there, a cake, with four candles, and outside. We had the party outside, in front. I think, maybe, four, or five kids were there. But, they were all taller than I, that, I think my mother said, at that point, that I didn't really have a playmate, because they were older. But, they liked to come and play with me, but I didn't have a friend, friend. So, they were all invited to the birthday party.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Had that, kind of, same experience. I was the little one ...

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. (laughs)

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... having the birthday.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, yeah. They're all standing around the table, tall, and here I am.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I believe that apartment complex were referred to as Ls, not Ks, but I may be wrong, but I believe it was the Ls. But anyway, just for the record. So, do you remember what you got for that birthday?

MRS. BAILEY: No.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: I don't.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Were you able to blow all the candles out?

MRS. BAILEY: I don't remember that, either, but, probably. My mother said I was always able to talk a lot, so I probably blew them out.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Was your mother a good cook?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, wonderful.

MR. HUNNICUTT: She make your birthday cakes?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah, I'm sure she did. I know she did. I remember that she did, later. But, I'm sure she did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You remember they were big and, generally, three-tiered cakes?

MRS. BAILEY: Yes, yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: With that homemade icing, and ...

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... on it.

MRS. BAILEY: And, this particular one was white.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Oh, yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. But, Mother's favorite cake to make was German chocolate. So, but they were always the three layer.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did your father like that German chocolate?

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: That's why she wanted to make it?

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. All of her preachers liked it, and so that's what she always gave people, was the German chocolate cake.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, do you know why the family kept moving from one location to another?

MRS. BAILEY: Trying to get a better accommodations. Although, that, I think, that when we lived in the apartment on Hillside was, like, the waiting period to get into another situation. From one, into another flattop, actually, on Wainwright, which was 105 Wainwright.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Who did your father work for, at that time? Do you remember?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, when we came here, he came with TVA. I don't know what TVA was doing, but they transferred him in. I, I guess, he was working for Clinton Engineer Works.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, was he a field surveyor, at that time?

MRS. BAILEY: He was a surveyor, I think, with these -- (clears throat) excuse me -- these certifications, he became a field engineer. And, at one time, became the party chief of the engineering group, the field engineering group.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, you, you’re saying that he, probably, did surveying work, when he worked ...

MRS. BAILEY: He was ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, did he work ...

MRS. BAILEY: He was a laborer for TVA, and surveyor. I mean, he, kind of, grew into that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Then, did he ever have any other job assignments, while he was here in Oak Ridge, other than that?

MRS. BAILEY: No. He worked in P&E.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, what is P&E?

MRS. BAILEY: Plant and Engineering. I think he worked some, he moved around some, the first several years. He worked at Y-12, and then, ended up, most of his employment was at X-10. He worked in the engineering department, the P&E Department. Their offices were in the Quonset huts, originally. I think they went into a brick building, after that, but ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, when your father was working, and your mother had you, by herself, at the time, then, your brother came along, a few years later. Do you remember how she went to the grocery store? How did she get around, if your father took the car to work, how did she get there?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, Daddy was always in a carpool, so, occasionally, she would have the car to herself, but not often. So, most of their trips to the grocery store, the two of them went together. He would drive her. Daddy was very protective.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, I suspect, you had to go, as well.

MRS. BAILEY: I, I guess I don't remember standing in line at grocery stores. As a young child, I remember going with Mother, later. But, she, actually, liked to do that by herself.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Where do you think she did most of her grocery shopping? Here in the Grove Center area, or do you remember?

MRS. BAILEY: I think, mostly, in the Grove Center area, and, maybe, Hilltop.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So then, when you guys moved to the cemesto on, what was that street again?

MRS. BAILEY: Everest.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Everest, yeah. Which, that put you in the east part of town, and, what school did you attend there?

MRS. BAILEY: I went to Elm Grove.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. And, how long did you go to Highland View?

MRS. BAILEY: I was there in kindergarten, and first, and half of second grade. Half of second grade, I went to Elm Grove, and finished the third grade there. Then, we moved back to our final home, across the street from Highland View School, in the fourth grade, and that's where we lived the rest of the time.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What do you remember about any of those grade years?

MRS. BAILEY: One of my fun memories was in kindergarten. I remember, or my mother tells me this story. Maybe, I don't totally remember it, but, it has become part of my memory, that she, and Daddy, were always told that I talked a lot. And, but they didn't scold me for it, and neither did the teacher. They put me in charge of, if there was something going on in kindergarten, and first grade, because I could give directions. I remember that. I remember one time in, in the fifth grade, there were two of us that, our teacher chose to be assistants to the lower grade teachers, couple of hours a day. We thought that was really great. We could go down, and, and, maybe, read to the students, or get them lined up. Just being a, an assistant teacher, for a couple hours a day. That didn't, we didn't do that for a very long time. A month, or two, in the fifth grade.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you remember ...

MRS. BAILEY: I really liked her, that teacher.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... the teacher's names, during that time?

MRS. BAILEY: Mrs. Slagle is the one who chose me, and Vickie, Vickie Miracle, to do that. I, she is the one that I vividly remember. I don't remember the other names. Tried to. I have made an effort, because I've looked at my report cards, but she's the one who really stands out.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you like school?

MRS. BAILEY: I did. I did like school. I liked it for, I liked it for the friendships you made. I liked it for the activities, and I liked it for, particular, I liked it because I enjoyed learning. I enjoyed participating. Yeah, I enjoyed school.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What do you remember that was your dress, that, how you dressed, when you went to school?

MRS. BAILEY: Little dresses. Little dresses, and socks, and shoes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What type of shoes did a girl wear?

MRS. BAILEY: Mary Janes, mostly. Mostly, little Mary Janes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Me, being a boy, you tell me what a Mary Jane looks like.

MRS. BAILEY: A Mary Jane is a shoe with a strap over the top of your foot. It's a little flat, and it has a strap over the top. I wear those, still today. My favorite shoe.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Are they pretty easy to come by, in the stores?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah, mmm-hmm, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What do you remember the weather being like, when you were growing up?

MRS. BAILEY: I remember it being very, very cold. Very cold. But, we played out in it. We, I don't remember much about rain, or, we didn't have any weather that would've been considered a disaster, or anything like that. But, we always played outside, then, you know. "Go outside, and play!" So, we would always play outside, and even if it was cold, we played outside. We had wet gloves, and wet shoes, and wet toboggans. The weather didn't stop us from doing things.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, the neighborhood that you lived in, the cemesto, was there a lot of kids in that area?

MRS. BAILEY: There were a number of them, mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, in the summertime, between school years, what do you remember doing for entertainment, and fun, during those times?

MRS. BAILEY: I don't think I did a whole lot, in the summer, until about the third, or fourth grade. We went on our usual trips to see grandmothers, and granddaddys, and occasionally, we would go to Florida. When the savings plan paid off, every two years, and we would take a, a week's trip to Florida, and that was always a big treat. But, what I remember most about the summers in Oak Ridge were the playgrounds. It was, it was simple, and it was good, and we were outside. We could do crafts. It was safe. We could do crafts, we could play softball, we could play all kinds of sports, and compete. That was fun. That was one of my favorite things. I lived right across the street from the Highland View School, from the fourth grade, on. If I was at the playground, which I was, many, many times, at five o'clock, my daddy would whistle, just across the street, and I'd hear it, and I'd run home, because dinner was on the table.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, was the playground on the end of the school, that ...

MRS. BAILEY: End, and back.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... you know, what ... today, and ...

MRS. BAILEY: End, and back.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... back was the ... Mmm-hmm. Do you remember a path back there, that came out ...

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... down, in another direction?

MRS. BAILEY: The one that went way down in the valley?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah, yeah. That was, actually, a ball field down there, at the very bottom. And, the path was very easy to get up, and down, on. There was a lot of, there were a lot of kudzu, and everything, surrounding it. It was an easy way to get down, if you played ball down there.

MR. HUNNICUTT: It's amazing that kudzu was here, back in the day. I guess it's always been around, somewhere.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, now, was that ball field a ball field that was just homemade, or was it something ... ?

MRS. BAILEY: It was a homemade field.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. Was it there by the, because the project made it.

MRS. BAILEY: No. The ball field that was made for the playground was up on the level of the school, or just in that top level, there. Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, how, how far down there would you think that would've been?

MRS. BAILEY: Down the hill, in the back?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Uh-huh.

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, I don't know, 150 yards, maybe.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Someone had told me about that before. Do you ever, no, this was another location. Never mind. Did, did your family have a radio. I guess they did, when you ...

MRS. BAILEY: We did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you listen to the radio a lot?

MRS. BAILEY: We did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What kind of programs did you listen to?

MRS. BAILEY: We listened to Amos and Andy.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Those were hilarious, weren't they?

MRS. BAILEY: They were so, so funny. We would, we'd listen to music, a lot, too.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You ever recall your mother listening to, 'Queen for a Day,' ...

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: … with Jack Bailey.

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yes. Jack Bailey.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: (laughs) Your husband's ...

MRS. BAILEY: My husband's name is Jack Bailey. He ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: He was your Queen for the Day.

MRS. BAILEY: He ... No, I'm his Queen for the Day. (laughter)

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah, I'll get it right.

MRS. BAILEY: He treats me that way.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What about ...

MRS. BAILEY: She did, she enjoyed that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Were you interested in Roy Rogers, or anything like that?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yes! Oh, yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Why, why would a girl be interested in Roy Rogers?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, because of Dale Evans. (laughs)

MR. HUNNICUTT: Oh.

MRS. BAILEY: He was a good singer, and I was singing at that, by that time, I was singing in church, and around. So, I, I really loved music, vocal music, and yeah, oh, yeah, everybody loved Roy Rogers. He was my favorite. Plus, Dale. In fact, that's probably one of the reasons Jack married me, because I was a Roy Rogers fan. The other reason was, because I was a Yankees fan. We grew up separately, different areas of town, but some of those interests brought us together.

MR. HUNNICUTT: We'll get to how you met, a little bit later. But ...

MRS. BAILEY: (coughs) Excuse me.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You mentioned savings plan. Tell me about that.

MRS. BAILEY: Well, as I understood it, you could voluntarily put so much money in, when you worked at one of the plants, if you, I think it was a Carbide program. You could put so much money in it a month and, I assume, it was invested. I'm not really sure about that, and you, you got some interest on it. Then, I believe, every two years, it paid out. So, I don't recall knowing how much money that was every couple of years, that Daddy would get, but we'd get, you know, buy a car, or take a vacation, or something like that. It was, it was a nice way to have a little extra.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I can remember all the retailers in town would start advertising about the, I think, what was it? June, or something.

MRS. BAILEY: I think so.

MR. HUNNICUTT: July, somewhere in that range. Come out and try to get you to ...

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... buy something from them.

MRS. BAILEY: Right.

MR. HUNNICUTT: But, that was a big thing that ...

MRS. BAILEY: It was.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... I think, later, they found out it was illegal to do that, and they quit doing it, after that.

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, really?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah, that's what ...

MRS. BAILEY: I didn't know that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: It was some complication that ...

MRS. BAILEY: Some kind of legality.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah, you're right. They'd save your money, and invest it, and you get a little interest back.

MRS. BAILEY: Uh-huh, uh-huh ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, it was quite a nice savings program.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, it was. Sometimes, I believe, we'd save it for Christmas, but then, there were always Christmas clubs you could join, too, at the banks.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Speaking of Christmas, describe how Christmas was in your family, growing up.

MRS. BAILEY: It was, generally, spent with just the four of us. We didn't make trips to our, our grandparents, at Christmas time, and they didn't come to visit us. We would go, maybe, at New Year's, or after Christmas, or something. But, it was always the four of us, and most of the time, we had a table-top tree, probably, because of space in the places we lived. Then, when we got into the larger place, we'd have a nice, cut tree. Sometimes, we'd cut it down behind us. We were, when we moved into that house on West Outer Drive, across from Highland View School, there were trees, but they weren't very high. So, we had all this valley view, back there. But there were a lot of nice trees back there, and we cut them down, or we'd go to the A&P, and buy a, a tree. Yeah, it was, it was a fun time. And, I never, never got the impression that we were not able to have Christmas. We always had a good Christmas.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, you felt like that your father's income was enough to make everybody happy, and comfortable, and wasn't scrounging around, or anything.

MRS. BAILEY: Right.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Most people that came, in the early days, here, they made pretty good money.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm, they did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, it, it made people feel better, anyway.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: At least there was work here.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. We were a one-income family. Daddy was from that generation that didn't want his wife to work.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, there's something to be said about that. But, today's society, I don't think that'd work, would it?

MRS. BAILEY: No, I don't think so.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Too high a cost of living.

MRS. BAILEY: It is, mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Let's talk a little more about what you remember about the Carbide Christmas parties. Did you ever attend those?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Where were they?

MRS. BAILEY: Where?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Uh-huh.

MRS. BAILEY: They were here, in Grove Center, I believe, at the theater.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Ok.

MRS. BAILEY: At the Grove Theater.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Later, they moved to the high school.

MRS. BAILEY: Later, they did. In fact, I was on the front page of the Oak Ridger, in one of the pictures. I was on the front row, and, it's kind of neat to look at that, and I remember that day. It's very exciting. And, Santa always came, and gave us these wonderful little see-through stockings.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Mesh type.

MRS. BAILEY: Mesh, that had candy, and little games, and things in it. And, oh, we just loved all that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Remember the candy canes? Everything was about ...

MRS. BAILEY: Candy canes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... the candy canes.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, a lot of those whistles, and blow out things ...

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... that aggravated your parents.

MRS. BAILEY: Right. And, little things with little beads to fit in the eyes, and the little toys. It was fun.

MR. HUNNICUTT: That thing was about as long as, half as long as your arm, if I remember right.

MRS. BAILEY: It was. I'd say, they're probably about like that. Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And they had entertainment, didn't they?

MRS. BAILEY: They did, but I don't remember the entertainment.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Seems like, to me ...

MRS. BAILEY: I mean, there was a program.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: And then, you went through the ritual of getting your stocking, and Santa. Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: It seems like, to me, they had entertainment sort of like, maybe, dog acts, or juggling acts, or clowns, or something that would appeal to kids, in those days. Wonderful, wonderful thing that Union Carbide did ...

MRS. BAILEY: Yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... for the community.

MRS. BAILEY: Yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Absolutely. And, I actually took my kids, when they was little, to the ...

MRS. BAILEY: Did you, really?

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... high school. Yes. Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Ah!

MR. HUNNICUTT: Whether they remember it, I don't know.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Anyway.

MRS. BAILEY: I'll have to show you that picture.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. I'm sure you helped your mother, in the kitchen, as you was growing up, like most girls was required to do.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What do you remember about your mother washing clothes, and how did she do it?

MRS. BAILEY: We had a wringer washer.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Tell me about a wringer washer.

MRS. BAILEY: Well, it (laughs) I don't know how well it washed clothes, but it could get, you could run your arm through the wringer. (laughs)

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you do that?

MRS. BAILEY: But you could pull it ... Yeah. But, you could pull it out quite easily, so it, it wasn't a hazard, that much of a hazard. We'd pull it out, and pull it up in front of the, the sink, hook the hose there, and load the washer with the, the water, hot water, or cold water, put the granular detergent in, put the Clorox in, or whatever it was, and (laughs) wash them. It would agitate. And then, we would wring them out, through this wringer, and then to hang them on the line.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, they had no rinse cycle ...

MRS. BAILEY: No.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... you just took, and dumped the water, start ...

MRS. BAILEY: You, well, you could do that, and, I guess, we did that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, you'd wring the clothes out, water would come out of them through the ...

MRS. BAILEY: Yes, and back into the tub of it. You could, then, drain it, and put fresh water in, to rinse. But, I don't remember doing that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Then, you put the clothes, I guess, in some sort of clothes basket.

MRS. BAILEY: Clothes basket.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, go ...

MRS. BAILEY: Go out on the line, and put on a little apron that had pockets with the ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Clothespins.

MRS. BAILEY: Clothespins. Some of them had round heads, some of them had flat heads. I still have some of Mother's.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, would that been just the kind that had a slit in the wood, slide over. And then, they had the spring type that clipped on.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm, mmm-hmm ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, you'd take them out to the clothesline. Now, was that something your father built, the clothesline?

MRS. BAILEY: You know, I think there was a clothesline there when we bought the house, when we moved into that house. You know, steel, some kind of aluminum, or ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, somebody ...

MRS. BAILEY: ... piping, and ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... made that.

MRS. BAILEY: I think they were there when we moved in.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah, back in the early days, when you first moved in, obviously, you had to make your own clothesline. Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: We had three lines on one pole.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you recall that your mother, and other neighbors, would visit at the clothesline, and ...

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... talk all the time.

MRS. BAILEY: Talk, back and forth from the clotheslines. Because, everyone had one.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, they, pretty much, was close to each other for that simple purpose, wasn't they?

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm. Yeah, the houses were fairly close. And, you know, it was, it was a routine. You did laundry on Monday, so everybody was out. I don't recall, before we had a washer, I guess, we washed, Mother washed clothes in the sink.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Or a washboard.

MRS. BAILEY: Or a washboard, or ... I know she did that growing up.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I'm sure.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. They didn't ...

MRS. BAILEY: They didn't have ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Very few washing machines ...

MRS. BAILEY: Right.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... in those days.

MRS. BAILEY: And then, there were no dryers, until later.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you recall the brand of washing powders that they had, in those days? I know Tide was ...

MRS. BAILEY: I think Tide was around. I think that's what I grew up on, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Still use it today?

MRS. BAILEY: No, I don't. (laughter) It's a little too abrasive, I guess. I haven't used it in so long, I don't know if it's changed.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, your brother, course, wore jeans, I'm sure, when he was growing up.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, your mother washed the jeans. Do you remember ...

MRS. BAILEY: Starched them.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you remember what else she used to do with them? You know, there was something that you put in your jeans.

MRS. BAILEY: There was some kind of form that you could put down in the jeans, and it would keep them ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Right.

MRS. BAILEY: ... pulled apart.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Pant stretchers.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. See, you would have never have thought of that.

MRS. BAILEY: No! No, you brought some things to my mind that I've not thought of in decades.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did your mother do a lot of ironing of the clothes?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, my! Mother loved to iron. She was such a good ironer. I, I liked to iron, actually. I don't do a whole lot of it. We don't have to. But, yeah, she loved to iron. She'd, she ironed everything: sheets, underwear, handkerchiefs, you know. Daddy didn't wear dress shirts to work, but he wore them to church, so he had a few.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did she have to starch the collars for him?

MRS. BAILEY: She would, she would starch the collars, and the cuffs. Yeah, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You mentioned going to church. Where did you attend church?

MRS. BAILEY: I think it was not until we moved up on Wainwright, that we actually went to church. So, I would've been five, or six. When we moved there, we started going to church across the street, at Highland View School. And, it was called the Oak Ridge Bible Church. So, we were in the school, in the audit -- in the gym. There were, that was called the Oak Ridge Bible Church, and we were there for several years. Then, there's a little bit of schism in the church, and we went to Central Baptist, for a little while. Then, the Oak Ridge Bible Church reformed, and built a church, an actual church building, in the Grove Center area, which they gave, it disbanded, or most of -- this was recently -- most of the members started going to Oak Ridge Baptist Church. Then, they didn't have the, they didn't use the church anymore. I think the AFL-CIO went into that building, and now it's gone. But ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, about where was that located?

MRS. BAILEY: That was straight this way from this building.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, when you came out by the Wildcat Den, on Robertsville, did you turn left?

MRS. BAILEY: Turned left. Uh-huh, by ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, there's a church on the corner ...

MRS. BAILEY: ... by the Alliance Church. Then, just right down there was this little, rectangular building, with a pitched roof.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you know what, when that building was built, by any chance?

MRS. BAILEY: No. I really don't. It, it had to be in, in the '50s.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Because, there was an East Church, down here, in this area, that ...

MRS. BAILEY: East?

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... for the Manhattan Project. But, it's, just, it was gone, or it's ...

MRS. BAILEY: No, I don't know about that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Either that, or the one on the corner we just talked about was it, and it's been converted, I don't know. But, it's been something I've been trying to find out about. Maybe someday I will. And ...

MRS. BAILEY: You know who went there? Juanita Hatcher. She grew up in that church on the side, on the corner.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I have to try to talk to her. I have, I have another friend, that's a member there, now, and she's going to investigate ...

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, good!

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... it for me. Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Good.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, to see ... But, you know how things are. When people die, and go away, sometimes, the history goes with them.

MRS. BAILEY: Goes with them.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, you never can find out exactly what transpired.

MRS. BAILEY: Just like our own grandparents. We don't think to ask all those questions.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Tell me about the, we, you mentioned the playground system, and you enjoyed that so much. Why did you enjoy the playgrounds?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, for one thing, I was, I just enjoyed playing ball, being competitive. I enjoyed having something good to do, to fill my day. You know, you could ride your bike over there, and park it, and spend all day, go home for lunch, come back, in the summer. It, it was, it was good for all of us kids. It was a disciplined area, the playground directors were forceful, but kind, and friendly, and ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you remember the schools having competition between each other, at playgrounds ...

MRS. BAILEY: Uh-huh ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... that was in ball, and ...

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm...

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... different things.

MRS. BAILEY: We had an Olympics, at the end of the school, of the summer.

MR. HUNNICUTT: There was a particular game, and I'm not real sure of the name of it. It was a steel pole in the ground ...

MRS. BAILEY: (whistling noise)

MR. HUNNICUTT: (laughs) You know where I'm going. Had a tennis ball on the end of it.

MRS. BAILEY: Yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, you had two paddles.

MRS. BAILEY: And you had a paddle.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, the other person had, and you tried to wrap that around.

MRS. BAILEY: Yes. I was never very good at that one.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What was the name of that? I've heard paddle ball, then, I've heard [inaudible] ball. I don't know where [inaudible] ball ...

MRS. BAILEY: [inaudible] ball.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... came from.

MRS. BAILEY: I don't know, I don't know. Ask Jack, when you talk to him. He'll know.

MR. HUNNICUTT: But, every playground had that.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And then, you could get your hand wrapped around that, with that paddle ...

MRS. BAILEY: You could.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... easily.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. I, I was never very good at that one.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You could, was supposed to hit it in, sort of, a loop angle, so that you couldn't get to it, and it could still wind around.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Those were the days.

MRS. BAILEY: I enjoyed playing it, and I kept thinking I was going to get better, but I never did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: When it rained, everybody went in the gym, didn't they?

MRS. BAILEY: Uh-huh. Well, we went in the gym. We could play basketball in there. Of course, there were basketball goals outside, also, on the asphalt. But there, the end classrooms, were open to us, also. We could go in there, and do whatever craft we were doing for the day, or ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: You mentioned bicycle. What type bicycle did you have?

MRS. BAILEY: I only had one bicycle, my whole life, and it was a 24-inch, women's bicycle. I don't recall the name of the bike. But, it was blue.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you get it for Christmas?

MRS. BAILEY: I got it for Christmas when I was in the third grade, because we were still living on Everest Circle, when I got it. And, Everest Circle had a kind of, a slope. It (laughs) it felt that way, anyway, when I was in the third grade. That's when I learned to ride a bike. A friend across the street, who was a couple of years older than me, held onto the bike, up at the top of the street, and walked with me, and then, let me go. Then, I ran, I just ran with it. But, that was, that was my first bike.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, you had no training wheels.

MRS. BAILEY: No. I didn't.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Those thing are more a hindrance ...

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... than they were a help.

MRS. BAILEY: (laughs) Yeah, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: If you get on one side ...

MRS. BAILEY: I know ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... you ...

MRS. BAILEY: I never had training wheels.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What about skates? Did you do ... ?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah. Did skating, but, that's about the time I started skating, too, because everybody had skates, and we would just skate on Everest Circle, back, and forth, back, and forth. And, we played canasta. That's when I learned to play (laughs) canasta, in the third grade.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Tell me about the skates. Do you recall how they, were they boot skates, or how, how did they ... ?

MRS. BAILEY: My first ones were not. They were the kind that strapped onto your shoes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Had to have a skate key.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. I don't remember what you did with the skate key.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, you had to tighten the front, to clamp ...

MRS. BAILEY: Ok, ok.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... against the sole of your shoe.

MRS. BAILEY: Ok, oh, that's right, right, to hold it, then, hold it in place ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: And then, if you fall off of them, they'd fall off.

MRS. BAILEY: Exactly.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Strap around the heel.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: The ankle.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. But, I really liked boot skates, later.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you go to the ...

MRS. BAILEY: To the skating rink.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... skating rink?

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm, mmm-hmm. I wasn't too bad at that, but I wasn't great.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Could you skate backwards?

MRS. BAILEY: I could. Not for long. I would, oh, get disoriented, or something.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What, tell me what you remember about the skating rink.

MRS. BAILEY: I remember the lights, the music, the older kids holding hands. I remember a lot of kids holding onto the bar, all the way around, until they learned to let go. And, and I remember how exciting it was that I learned to make the corners, you know, put this foot ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Foot in front of the other.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. And, make those corners. I loved doing the corners. Yeah, that was fun. We'd go in groups, and do that, so you, we always had a friend there with you.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I can remember going, and skating was fine, until they said, "Couples Skate."

MRS. BAILEY: Couples! (laughter)

MR. HUNNICUTT: That's all she wrote!

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, I think I probably went off to ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, some of those kids were pretty good, skating backwards ...

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... and dance break.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. Oh, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: If you lived in the western part of Oak Ridge, you frequently visited the skating rink, and you learned how to do all that. Living in the east, every now and then, you'd go down there, you know.

MRS. BAILEY: Really?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah, I mean, people lived in the east, stayed in the east, and the, the sort of, in the middle here, and the west. You didn't travel around much to each other's ...

MRS. BAILEY: You really didn't. You really didn't. And, I didn't do much when I got older.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. Well, you didn't ...

MRS. BAILEY: I didn't have a car, for one thing.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: You know, in high school.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, all the grocery shopping, and everything’s, scattered out ...

MRS. BAILEY: Wherever you were.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Right.

MRS. BAILEY: Which was the way, the planning, which was really good, because there weren't that many cars.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Tell me about going to junior high. Where did you attend?

MRS. BAILEY: I went to Robertsville Junior High School. That's where I met Jack. We had a really good group there. Judy Wyrick, Judy Anderson, and I, lots of people, played ... You remember that the school board, and the superintendent, and all the principals, didn't approve of girls competing at sports, when we were junior high, and high school age. We did it as intramurals, but not as interscholastic, until couple years after we graduated. So, and, we really wanted to do that. I loved playing softball, and I was terrible at basketball. But, it was fun. In junior high, I was a cheerleader in junior high school, and that was fun. I remember, it was our first time to really do anything very active, in PE [physical education]. We did a lot of tumbling, and diving over people. That was fun.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, what got your interest to want to be a cheerlogger, cheerleader?

MRS. BAILEY: I, probably, because some of my friends were interested. It was a disappointment, when I got to high school, because I was never selected to be a cheerleader, in the tenth, eleventh, and twelfth.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, who did the selection?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, well, it was a popular vote.

MR. HUNNICUTT: By the school ...

MRS. BAILEY: By the school.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... kids?

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm, mmm-hmm. Every year, the PE teacher would say, "Oh, you just missed it." But, I really enjoyed it, in, at Robertsville. It was ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Who was your PE teacher?

MRS. BAILEY: Gottshall [inaudible] ... Tee Purrier [sp?] was at junior high.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now ...

MRS. BAILEY: Mrs. Ms. Swayze, also.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I think she taught in a lot of different places.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm, she did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: She had some kids that went to school, didn't she? Through the school system?

MRS. BAILEY: I think so.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: My, one of my favorite teachers was the music teacher, Robertsville. Genevive Johnson, and I think she, she, probably, did more encouraging me, than any, than any teacher I had.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, you liked music, and you mentioned you started singing, and sing, sung in the church. What got you interested in singing? Why, why did you like that?

MRS. BAILEY: Mother said I always sang. I, growing up, little, I would hear music on the radio, and just sing along.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, how did you ... ?

MRS. BAILEY: It just seemed to be something natural.

MR. HUNNICUTT: How did you develop your voice, through the years?

MRS. BAILEY: Just singing.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Were you able to read music?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, I did take piano, for about three years, so I could read music.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, does reading music help you sing. Obviously ...

MRS. BAILEY: It does.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... it puts you into the song.

MRS. BAILEY: It does.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you sing today?

MRS. BAILEY: I do. Mmm-hmm. I don't sing as much as I used to, but I'm singing in the choir at church. Yeah. And, I do solos, here and there.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you notice, when you were younger, how much ability you had, or capacity of air, to sing, versus what you've got now?

MRS. BAILEY: What I've got now? (laughter) Yeah, that diaphragm just doesn't want to move, and it needs to.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What about the pitches in your voice? How does that work?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, I didn't sing for a little while, when we were living in Florida, I developed some kind of cough that persisted, just could not get it to go away. And so, I think I damaged my vocal chords, a little bit. But, when we came, when we moved here, back to Oak Ridge, I started singing a little bit. And, it, you just need to practice. Just need to sing, and it'll come back. The range is about the same as it was when I was younger. Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Is there any type songs you do not like to sing?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, I'm sure there're lots of songs in today's repertoire (laughs) that I wouldn't want to sing.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, let me rephrase ...

MRS. BAILEY: My, my favorite songs to sing are hymns, or Christian songs. I like the oldies, meaning the '30s, and '40s. My mother used to tell me that I was, I was born too late. I needed to be born, I needed to be in my prime in the '30s, and '40s, because of the songs.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, I guess, when you got to high school, you probably went to a lot of dances, the high school had.

MRS. BAILEY: We did. I did a lot of the, you know, we had talent shows every year. I did those. I ... I was given a lot of encouragement, there, too, to pursue music. I did, to the extent of, a voice lesson, here or there. But, I'm not a musician. I ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: You still play the piano?

MRS. BAILEY: I still play the piano, but it's ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Just for personal playing.

MRS. BAILEY: It really is, just for personal pleasure, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: When you first went to a voice lesson, tell me what they do at voice lessons. What would they be doing?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, the first time I went to a voice lesson, Doc Coombs, wanted me to sing an aria at the state competition, and so, he chose 'Un bel di,' from "Madame Butterfly." And, it was in Italian, and so, he, he gave me the name, well, he arranged to have me have several lessons with this lady in town. I wish I could remember who it, who she was. But, I don't. That was the first time I had a voice lesson.

MR. HUNNICUTT: How did you go about learning an Italian song?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, she, of course, was proficient in the languages, other than English, for singing. So, she told me how to pronounce everything. Because I'd never had any Italian, but, she was very good. I did sing that song at state competition, and I also sang it in the Miss Oak Ridge pageant, in 1962.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you recall ...

MRS. BAILEY: But, I didn't win anything! (laughs)

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you recall the words today?

MRS. BAILEY: "Un bel di, vedremo." That's all I remember. (laughs) I have the music, though. I could learn, and begin, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, was you a contestant in Oak Ridge, Miss Oak Ridge?

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: When was that?

MRS. BAILEY: 1962, the year we graduated.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, what possessed you to enter that contest?

MRS. BAILEY: Judy Anderson entered it, Jo Klein, Gwen Ashburn, they were all, and they said, "Aw, come on, come on!" So, I was just egged on to enter it, and they'd say, "Oh, you've got to, you've got to. You'll win the talent," you know. But, it was, it was nice to have somebody rooting for you.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I don't, I don't remember that.

MRS. BAILEY: You don't? (laughs)

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... not being there, I guess. Tell me what that consisted of.

MRS. BAILEY: Well, it was fun. It was my first entree into dressing properly, and sitting at a table, and eating properly. We were all taught, we had etiquette classes, and we had diction classes, and we had appearances we had to make. It was, kind of, fun. I wouldn't want to do it as a living, but, I admire the people who do, because it's, kind of, rigorous. But, you know, be very satisfying, if you like that sort of thing.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Oh, were you asked questions, like they do today?

MRS. BAILEY: No.

MR. HUNNICUTT: No?

MRS. BAILEY: No.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you have to wear swim trunks?

MRS. BAILEY: We had to wear, we had talent, evening gown, and swimsuit.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, is the swimsuit all the same, for every contestant?

MRS. BAILEY: No.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Was that your choice, of what ...

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... to wear.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm...

MR. HUNNICUTT: But, obviously, you couldn't wear a two-piece swimsuit.

MRS. BAILEY: Or there probably weren't any.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: They were all one piece.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. And, did you have ...

MRS. BAILEY: I'm sure they would've restricted that.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... to wear high-heeled shoes for swimsuit?

MRS. BAILEY: Yes, mmm-hmm...

MR. HUNNICUTT: See, I know more about that ... (laughter)

MRS. BAILEY: You have watched.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, I have (laughter) in the later years. At that time period, I wasn't interested in any of that kind of stuff.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: By any means.

MRS. BAILEY: My mother made my dress.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, that was quite ...

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, it was beautiful.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... something, wasn't it?

MRS. BAILEY: It was beautiful.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What color was it?

MRS. BAILEY: It was gold, on the bottom, and a greenish gold on the top. Strapless, fitted, and then, a flowing gold. She, and I, have no idea whatever happened to it.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I bet she was proud, wasn't she?

MRS. BAILEY: She was. It was a beautiful dress.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Any time you can make something for your kids, and they can use it, it, you got to be proud of that.

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. She made most of my clothes, growing up.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did she make clothes for your brother, as well?

MRS. BAILEY: No, I don't think so. She didn't like those notched collars, on shirts. (laughs)

MR. HUNNICUTT: I'd say not. Did you like high school?

MRS. BAILEY: Uh-huh.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What were some of your teachers you remember, in high school?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: You have a favorite? You can say now, because all these teachers probably not with us anymore.

MRS. BAILEY: I, actually, I liked Mrs. Gottshall. I liked PE. I guess I was a, a female jock.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Who did you have for senior English?

MRS. BAILEY: Give me a name.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Mrs. Stansbury [sp?].

MRS. BAILEY: No.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Turner.

MRS. BAILEY: (coughs) Turner.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Mazel Turner.

MRS. BAILEY: Mazel Turner.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I had Stansbury.

MRS. BAILEY: I learned a little. (laughs) Yeah. English was a good subject for me.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What about, did you take any math classes, or ...

MRS. BAILEY: Math was not a good subject, for me. I did, I had Algebra I, and plane geometry, and Algebra II. That was my limit.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you take you a Home Ec. class, when you were going?

MRS. BAILEY: We had Home Ec., yes. We also had it in junior high. I had Home Ec.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you enjoy that?

MRS. BAILEY: I wasn't very good at it.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You'd rather have been playing ball.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah. I think so. I, I didn't wear what I made.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Do you remember who the Home Ec. teacher might've been?

MRS. BAILEY: No. So many people remember all their teachers' names, and I do not.

MR. HUNNICUTT: The thing I remember was when it's time to go home. (laughter)

MRS. BAILEY: I remember missing the bus. No, I enjoyed high school. I, I really did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Where were you living when you went to the high school?

MRS. BAILEY: I was living at 468 West Outer Drive, across from Highland View School.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, you would catch the bus, you'd ride the bus.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmmm, stopped right in front of my house. I wouldn't even leave the house until he stopped. I'd be standing at the door. Whatever the weather was, he'd be right there on the, the crest of that hill, and I would see him, and run to the bus.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Where did the buses let us off at the high school?

MRS. BAILEY: I remember going in the front, the door that's on Pasadena, that way. But, I remember leaving out the other way. I don't know if that's correct, but ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, it could've been where the bus was coming from. When I rode it, we got out on the Turnpike side.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, that's where you got off, and that's where you caught a bus, if you were leaving. But, I lived in the east part of town.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, it could've been where you lived.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, it could've been. We came down Highland, and then, turned in on Pasadena, and, I don't think it took us right to the door. I think, right along, right along the side.

MR. HUNNICUTT: That side street, probably.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm, mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: When you were in high school, in the gymnasium, the old gym's that there now, was there a divider between the boys' side and the girls' side?

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You remember what that was made out of? It was something that would close, and open.

MRS. BAILEY: Right. It was accordion, kind of, closing, I believe.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did you have that at Robertsville, as well?

MRS. BAILEY: We did, mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Jefferson had it.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: It was a curtain that was pulled across.

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, it was a curtain?

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah. We got in trouble for that, too. (laughter) So, when you graduated from high school, what happened?

MRS. BAILEY: Jack broke up with me.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Oh, no!

MRS. BAILEY: For another girl.

MR. HUNNICUTT: After all those years.

MRS. BAILEY: After all those years. No, I was torn between going to Appalachian Bible College, or Middle Tennessee State University. Because, Doc Coombs got me a partial scholarship, music scholarship to Middle Tennessee State, and I grew up with a lot of the graduates of the Appalachian Bible College, being our ministers. So, I was very familiar with that, and I wanted to go into Christian service. I didn't know if it was going to be music side, or teaching, or whatever. So, I decided to go to ABC, and didn't go to Middle Tennessee State.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, how long were you there?

MRS. BAILEY: It was a three-year school. I graduated in three years -- '62, I graduated in '65.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And that was in music?

MRS. BAILEY: No, that was in Christian Education.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Ok. So, what ...

MRS. BAILEY: With a minor in music.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What did you do after you graduated?

MRS. BAILEY: I worked at ORNL [Oak Ridge National Laboratory], for a year, because I knew I was going to get married a year after I graduated. So, I worked to save some money, and we got married, and we went off, gone the rest of our lives.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Now, wait a minute, now. Let's back up.

MRS. BAILEY: (laughs) That's the way it happened.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You married the same Jack that broke up with you ...

MRS. BAILEY: I did.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... right out of high school?

MRS. BAILEY: He came, he came to his senses.

MR. HUNNICUTT: I see.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: All right.

MRS. BAILEY: When he was a junior, and I had graduated, when he was a junior, he came to his senses, and begged to come back. (laughter) Not really, not really. I was ready.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Where did you all get married, and when?

MRS. BAILEY: We got married June 4, 1966, at First Presbyterian Church, in Oak Ridge. Jack grew up at First Presbyterian, and my church was really small, and so, we decided to have it there. But my minister married us.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What was his name?

MRS. BAILEY: George Leutge.

MR. HUNNICUTT: How do you spell that?

MRS. BAILEY: L-E-U-T-G-E. That's close, anyway.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, where was the first home that you guys lived in?

MRS. BAILEY: Our first home was at the University of Alabama Jean Carden worked at the lab, and was also a professor at University of Alabama, in engineering. They went to our church, here in Oak Ridge. Jack had a couple of hours he needed to finish, that summer of '66, so we went to Alabama. We went to Tuscaloosa, and we lived in Jean, and Patsy's house, on campus, for two and a half months, and then, he graduated, and we left. But that's, that was our first house. The second was when we started with the Penney Company, we moved to Danville, Virginia.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, what year would that've been?

MRS. BAILEY: ‘66.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, what was Jack's position there?

MRS. BAILEY: He was a trainee, with the Penney Company.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, how long did you live there?

MRS. BAILEY: Four years.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And then, did Jack's career with Penney's escalate?

MRS. BAILEY: Yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What, what happened?

MRS. BAILEY: From there, we went, we came home, actually. He opened the store at West Town. Bill Neil was the manager there, and he was a department manager, and we lived in Knoxville. The shortest stint anywhere was 18 months, and we would've begged to stay here much longer, but we didn't get to. We had our daughter, in Virginia. She was two-years-old, when we moved here.

MR. HUNNICUTT: What's her name?

MRS. BAILEY: Kathy [inaudible].

MR. HUNNICUTT: You have other children?

MRS. BAILEY: We have two children, Kathy, and Darrell [sp?].

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, where are they today?

MRS. BAILEY: Kathy is married, with two wonderful kids, in Aiken, South Carolina. And, Darrell is living with us, right now. He's in between fashion jobs. He's a denim expert, designer, etcetera. And, he has come home, and is looking for another job.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You guys went to Florida, and ...

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, lived there two different times.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... and then, how long were you in Florida?

MRS. BAILEY: Total, 16 years. First place, we were there four years. The second, was much longer.

MR. HUNNICUTT: But then, you came back to Oak Ridge, didn't you?

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Jack retire, then ...

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... when you came back. And you, you and Jack both are involved in Rotary. I'd like for you to tell me what, from the lady's side, what a person would do in Rotary.

MRS. BAILEY: Rotary is a, an international organization that tries to do good in the world. We're all over the world. You can get involved in what you do in your own town, your own state, or you can branch out, and do projects throughout the world. Women have not always been in Rotary. I don't remember the year, but I think it was, like, 1985, when women were allowed to join Rotary. Women make up, probably, 50 percent of Rotarians, now. We can get involved at anything, at, at the club level, as far as being an officer, a leader, in the club, we can do hands-on projects, that we do in your local community. If we aspire to do more than just the local community, we can, we can do that. We can grow in the club, and accept more responsibility. It is, it's, basically, a, a club where people want to put their talents to make the world a better place. Our main project, the one that has identified us over the last 20 years, is ending polio, around the world. We're down to two countries, who have very few Rotary cases -- Rotary cases -- polio cases. So, we're really very close to eradicating polio in the world. That's a joint venture with the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, the World Health Organization, the Disease Control Agency, and Rotary.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, how, is there an age limit for being a member of Rotary?

MRS. BAILEY: No, no. It's made up of, of professionals in a town, and anyone who, who wants to get involved in your community, and make the world a better place, by your personal participation, can join Rotary.

MR. HUNNICUTT: When does the organization meet?

MRS. BAILEY: We meet once a week.

MR. HUNNICUTT: At various places, or do you have a ...

MRS. BAILEY: Well, actually, Oak Ridge has three Rotary clubs. There's a Breakfast Rotary Club, a lunch Rotary Club, and an evening Rotary Club, which is called Sunset, Oak Ridge Sunset. So, one meets in the morning, one at noon, and one at night. So, that fits somebody's schedule.

MR. HUNNICUTT: So, by having the three, you, you fit to anyone ...

MRS. BAILEY: To anyone's sch ... schedule.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... that wants to join, that's working, or non-working.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm. They're mostly working people.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Are all three ... ?

MRS. BAILEY: Or retired.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Obviously, all three's goals is the same.

MRS. BAILEY: Mmm-hmm.

MR. HUNNICUTT: But, do they do, basically, the same functions, or ... ?

MRS. BAILEY: Well, we do a number of things together. It's good to, to do that. You get more accomplished when you have more people involved in something. But, we all, each club, has its own particular projects, in the community. Fundraisers, you know, packing book bags. Fundraisers for ADFAC [Aid to Distressed Families of Appalachian Counties] or, just, lots of different things. And, Rotary, I believe, all over the world, maybe it's, maybe it's just the English-speaking countries, are responsible for every third grader in school to get their own dictionary. So, that's, that's just one small thing we do.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Tell me about, your opinion about, growing up in Oak Ridge. What do you, what would you say to someone that didn't know.

MRS. BAILEY: It's surprising that there're a lot of people, a lot of our peers, from around the country, don't know about Oak Ridge, which seems a little surprising, to me. But, when we talk about Oak Ridge, and what a fantastic place it was to grow up, people start to appreciate what all we did. It was a great place to grow up. We had everything possibly thought of, for a community. We had the best schools. We had a community feel to it, where everybody felt responsible for the other person, and, and it was just a very good, close community feel. I know that there are other places that people just love, and they grew up in, but this just has a special, a very special place in my heart. We couldn't think of a better place to retire, and come back home. And, you can come back home. We'd, we'd, honestly, and, of course, where we are, in East Tennessee, it's the most eye-pleasing place in the world, I think. Everything that's just, right here at your fingertips, to do, and see. We didn't, I don't think we fully appreciated it, growing up. But, we, we truly had a wonderful place, and, and, I think, I think it's still a wonderful place.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Is there anything you want to talk about that I haven't covered?

MRS. BAILEY: Oh, my gosh! (laughs) Well, one of the things we really enjoyed is getting back in touch with people we grew up with, and that's been so much fun. You know, we head off in all of our different directions, and some of us come back home, and some never left, and ... But, we still have, share the same memories, and, maybe, it's from a different perspective, but we still have all those things. I love that part, where ... And, of course, coming back home, it's not like going to a new place. You know where things are, and, but having that reunion with people you grew up with, and the same bonds, that's been very special.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Your parents, both, deceased, here in Oak Ridge?

MRS. BAILEY: Yes.

MR. HUNNICUTT: And, they've been, lived a wonderful life, here, I'm sure.

MRS. BAILEY: They loved it here.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Did your mother have any complaints when she came to Oak Ridge?

MRS. BAILEY: No, no. My mother was so excited about having her own home, and ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: A lot of this was new ...

MRS. BAILEY: ... she ...

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... upscale, for them, wasn't it?

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, yeah. Mother grew up on a farm, and she worked the farm, with her daddy, and, you know, they, she said, we, we were poor, but we didn't know it.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Right.

MRS. BAILEY: We had everything we needed.

MR. HUNNICUTT: You can be poor, and happy.

MRS. BAILEY: Yeah, yeah.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Yeah.

MRS. BAILEY: But, she was excited about starting her own family, in a new place.

MR. HUNNICUTT: People earned a pretty good wage, in those days.

MRS. BAILEY: A challenge. Mmm-hmm. She made some really good friends, here. Lifelong.

MR. HUNNICUTT: Well, it's been my pleasure interviewing you, Pat. So ...

MRS. BAILEY: Thank you, Don.

MR. HUNNICUTT: ... thank you, very much, for spending this time with us. And, it's been my pleasure.

MRS. BAILEY: Mine, also, mine, also.

[End of Interview]

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