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>> This is the existential approach to counseling in psychotherapy and in this session I'm going to ask you to imagine this is our fifth counseling session of existential therapy and last week in our fourth session we were talking about Stan's anxiety over making choices and Stan also brought up some beginning discussion of death and his anxiety around the fact that he's mortal. So, I asked him to think about some of this and be sure to bring it into our next session. So you'll be seeing here a continuation of where we left off last week around anxiety surrounding his realization that he doesn't have forever. Last week, Stan, we were talking in our sessions about death, remember that came up? And you broached that subject and said that this is scary for you and we also talked somewhat about anxiety that you feel a lot and I remember that we ended and there was a lot that was unfinished and I asked you perhaps to go home and think about it and write in your journal too. Did you have after thoughts since we met last?

>> Stan: I actually almost didn't come in this week.

>> Didn't?

>> Stan: Well, I had some stuff with my dad happen. He wound up in the hospital with some heart problems and they did some procedures and he's okay, but it really scared me, it really made me think about what's going to happen when he dies, how it's going to be for me and the part that I got really mad about at myself was that all I could think about was, oh, my God, I don't want my dad to die before I finish school so he can't, he's not going to see me graduate. I thought, oh, my, man, just how selfish, what a selfish thought. It just really made me think of my dad is only 58 and made me think about where I am at in my life. I'm 35, haven't finished school, I haven't started a career, I haven't done much.

>> Well, there was a whole lot that you just now said. One of the things that you said that you thought about was being scared. Could you say just a bit more about scared? That was one.

>> Stan: Uhm, well, even though I have so much trouble with my dad I'm still afraid of losing him and what that means to me. I was really afraid that he would die without seeing me be successful.

>> And what does that bring up right now as you say that to me?

>> Stan: It makes me feel really dependent.

>> Does it bring up any feelings too as you say that? That he might die without seeing you be successful?

>> Stan: I just feel anxious about it. Like I really want to kind of turn up the steam a little bit and get my stuff done, but then it makes me think, well, what am I doing school for anyway, you know? If I'm just doing it to prove something to him.

>> Right. But you know maybe you could be in school because it's something important to you and also might please him? One doesn't have to rule out the other does it?

>> Stan: Not necessarily I guess.

>> Yeah. You also said you're a bit mad that maybe he was going to leave.

>> Stan: Well, I was more mad at myself for here's my dad he could be dying in the hospital and I'm worried about that he's going to die before I finish school.

>> Yeah.

>> Stan: That, yeah, that's kind of a selfish thought.

>> Yeah. And maybe it is but maybe that's your thought and your feeling nevertheless. Maybe you want him around to see you in a different way.

>> Stan: Yeah.

>> It sounds in some way like that brush with death that your father had really affected you in a lot of ways.

>> Stan: Yeah, it did. It really made me, I mean it's funny that it happened right after our last week's session, but it really made me think about what am I doing? What is my, why am I even here?

>> Yeah.

>> Stan: What have I done? Nothing. Zero.

>> And you added you said I'm 35 and I haven't done.

>> Stan: Yeah.

>> A whole lot yet.

>> Stan: Thirty-five, divorced, no degree, not really worked, I mean I'm kind of working on a career but I haven't started a career. All of my friends from high school they're married, kids, they have, you know, their lives are going.

>> So you'd like to be in a different place than you are right now?

>> Stan: Yeah. Yeah.

>> You know sometimes I think the recognition not just the intellectual recognition of death but really the acceptance that I don't have forever I don't know how many years I'll have almost jars us into taking every day and every moment seriously. I'm wondering if that episode kind of shook you up a bit?

>> Stan: Yeah. I certainly have been this last week I've really just been this last week I've really just been I don't know maybe I've been a little bit of a funk about it kind of really looking at things that I think have been kind of in the back of my mind and haven't really thought about that much. And so it's really kind of brought those things more forward for me.

>> And what did it bring forward?

>> Stan: Kind of the idea of I better hurry up. I've got a lot of things I want to do.

>> Okay. You say there are a lot of things you want to do. Maybe could you just give me a little bit handle on what are some of those things you'd want to do like what would you want to do that would bring meaning to your life? What would it take?

>> Stan: Well, I want to be able to work with kids.

>> Okay.

>> Stan: But to do that I have to do some other things first. I need to get my degree to do that and so that is kind of the first step towards getting where I want to be.

>> And are you doing that? Are you taking that first step?

>> Stan: Yes, I am. I am doing that.

>> So you're working towards it.

>> Stan: Right. I should have done it a long time ago but I am doing it now.

>> Okay, but you're doing it.

>> Stan: Right.

>> And are there other people in your classes that are returning students?

>> Stan: There's some.

>> Some.

>> Stan: They don't seem to have the gray hair that I have though.

>> Yeah. [laughter] But I notice you do a lot of that. You're kind of very hard on yourself at times. I should have been there, I should have been different, I should have made another decision, I've wasted a lot of my life, I hear a lot of that.

>> Stan: It certainly feels that way.

>> Yeah. I wonder if being as hard on yourself as you are if it helps you get where you want to get?

>> Stan: Probably not.

>> Probably not.

>> Stan: Probably not.

>> Yeah.

>> Stan: Yeah.

>> So, I'm hoping that maybe, you know, you can recognize maybe I didn't do everything I wanted but I hope you can be a little bit kinder to yourself.

>> Stan: Okay. Kind of hard.

>> Yeah. You hear a lot of those voices that are pretty harsh, I think. I'd like to hear a little bit more about what it would mean for you if you had your degree and you were helping kids?

>> Stan: Well, I think I want it to matter that I was even here.

>> Okay.

>> Stan: Right now I don't feel like it matters if I'm here or not here.

>> So it matters meaning you matter?

>> Stan: Right. That I matter in the world or even in my community. So, I'd like to be able to make a difference somewhere.

>> Yeah. And so is your picture that if you're working with kids that that's going to help you find a way?

>> Stan: To me that would be a lot more meaningful than what I have been doing. I think actually that I might be pretty good at it. I've been through a lot when I was a kid and I think that I can help other kids get through whatever it is that they're going through.

>> And what do you think that would do for you if you're able to help kids? How do you think that would help you? What would you get from doing that?

>> Stan: I don't know. Satisfaction maybe. A feeling of accomplishment, a feeling like I belong maybe.

>> So that you are making a difference.

>> Stan: Yeah.

>> A sense that I'm here for some purpose, yeah. So you think you're moving in that direction?

>> Stan: Slowly. [laughter]

>> Slowly, but you're moving.

>> Stan: But I am, yes, I am.

>> In that direction. Yeah, and you're right we don't have forever to get [inaudible]. So I think in a way maybe the recognition of death and your anxiety around that makes a lot of sense. It could help us take today more seriously.

>> Stan: Yeah.

>> I can appreciate wanting to make a difference. That's important in my life surely, you know, and I as listen to you talk about I want to somehow make a difference in lives of others it's something that is very important to me. So I appreciate what you're saying.

>> Stan: Thanks. Yeah. It makes me wonder what life would be like without my dad too.

>> Well, what do you think it might be like without him?

>> Stan: I don't know. I really, I've never even imagined it.

>> And if you were to imagine it right now that he is gone, how do you think that would be for you?

>> Stan: Hard.

>> Hard.

>> Stan: There's a lot of things I want to say to him.

>> Can you think of one or two things you'd want to say? You're thinking.

>> Stan: Yes, I am. I'm thinking. Well, I'd like to ask him some things, what he thinks of me, has he ever been proud of me, what could I have done differently to, I don't know, make him proud or satisfied.

>> So that stands out.

>> Stan: Yeah.

>> I want him to feel proud of me. Can you ever imagine that happening?

>> Stan: No. No.

>> No.

>> Stan: That's kind of the paradox that, yeah, I can't imagine me ever asking that question. That's a scary question.

>> Oh, you can't imagine yourself asking the question?

>> Stan: I can't imagine me getting up the courage to do that.

>> Oh. Uh-huh. It would take a lot of courage to ask that.

>> Stan: Yeah, yeah.

>> Uh-huh.

>> Stan: It would take a lot.

>> Well, could you at least in your own mind think for just a moment of what you would like him to say? You said I really wonder if he ever was proud of me. Can you think of anything that he could say that --

>> Stan: -- I would like him to pick one thing out of my life that he was proud of that he could say specifically, Stan, when you did this, I was proud of you versus that, ah, yeah, kid I'm proud of you. That kind of thing.

>> Yeah. Well, he's still here and do you see this is more what you want to talk about in this session and our future sessions about your relationship with your father and about realizing you don't know how long he'll live.

>> Stan: Yeah.

>> I wonder if that would be a start for you. If you could talk to him a little bit about what it was like for you when he went to the hospital?

>> Stan: Maybe.

>> Maybe.

>> Stan: It may be hard to do face-to-face.

>> Uh-huh. So we're almost out of time with this session, Stan, and I want to get a sense of how it was for you.

>> Stan: It was good. I think I come up with some new things to look at.

>> Right. And one of them you mentioned is talking to your father particularly about him being in the hospital, but you said you weren't quite ready for that.

>> Stan: Right. That might take a little while.

>> Right. But would you like to be able to say something to him about that?

>> Stan: I think so. It's kind of a scary thought, but I think eventually maybe one day.

>> Right, but I have an idea.

>> Stan: Okay?

>> Hear what this might sound like to you.

>> Stan: Okay.

>> You're writing in your journal. How about if you write him a letter in your journal? And I'm not suggesting you send the letter to him but just write the letter and say, dad, I'd like to tell you what your being in the hospital brought up in me. Is that something you --

>> Stan: -- I can do that.

>> You could do that.

>> Stan: Uh-huh.

>> And then maybe next week you could bring --

>> Stan: -- bring my journal.

>> Yeah. And either read the letter or tell me what it was like to write the letter.

>> Stan: Okay.

>> And the reason I'm suggesting this is more to give you an opportunity to do a little bit more with this even if you don't do it with him in real life.

>> Stan: Okay.

>> In this demonstration of existential psychotherapy, I think there were two themes that came out that are very existential. One was Stan's death anxiety and the other was meaning and life. Really the existential approach those are two very important themes that existentialists pay a lot of attention to. The death really is a catalyst to have us re-evaluate and search to find the meaning and the purpose of our lives. Stan brought up an episode with his father that his father's hospitalization brought a lot of anxiety into his own life in thinking about what is the direction of my life? What's the purpose? What have I accomplished so far? And I wouldn't want to, you know, minimize that. I would really want to give Stan an opportunity to talk more about his feelings and thoughts about what he's accomplished and more importantly what directions he wants to move toward, which is what we were doing in this session. Stan brought up a concern about his father and what his father would think of him and particularly about his father being proud of him. That seemed to stand out for me because in a lot of ways I think Stan is very concerned about somehow I'll be worthwhile when my father acknowledges my worth. So I would like to do more work on that. Stan said at the end that, you know, it was scary thinking about even the prospect of talking to his father and asking him that question. The question about, you know, were you ever proud of me? Have I done anything to make you feel proud of me. So, my idea was maybe Stan would go home and write in his journal and write a letter to his father. Again, not a letter that he would send but a letter that would help him get clearer with his own struggle with his father. I want to emphasize they're very few techniques that are part and parcel of the existential approach. Now I'm free to draw from techniques from all of the other schools of therapy, but I think the main thing I want to really do here is get inside of the world of Stan. I want to see the world as he's seeing it and encourage him to develop a deeper understanding of himself, which I think he's doing in terms of what it's going to take to give my life a richer substance.

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