2004 Disability Program Navigator Training: Affordable ...



2004 Disability Program Navigator Training

Audio Conference Series

Affordable & Accessible Housing

April 15, 2004

Featured speaker:

Sharon Brent - Moderator

Program Associate

Law, Health Policy & Disability Center

Washington, D.C.

202/336-7689

sbrent@

Laura Farah - Moderator

Program Associate

Washington, D.C. Office

Quincy, MA

617-471-1570

lfarah@mail.law.uiowa.edu

James Yates

Associate, Housing & Homeless Team

Technical Assistance Collaborative, Inc.

Boston, Massachusetts

For information about other audio conferences in this series or to listen to the archive of this conference, go to the following Web address:



Laura Farah: Good afternoon, everyone. Again, I am Laura with the Law, Health Policy and Disability Center of the University of Iowa College of Law. And my colleague, Sharon Brent, and I are going to facilitate today's conference call.

Sharon Brent: Good afternoon and welcome, everybody, this is Sharon, and I also work for the University of Iowa.

Laura Farah: And for those of you who are joining us for the first time today, welcome. And for those of you who have had the opportunity to participate on the other two calls, we are glad you are back.

As James said when announced the call, today's audio conference is on affordable and accessible housing, it is the third in a series of ten audio conferences. The audio conference series started in February, where we learned about Medicaid Waivers and Medicaid Buy-In. And in March, we learned about Transportation, the Vehicle to Getting There. This series is sponsored by the Department of Labor and the Social Security Administration’s Disability Program Navigator initiative, along with the Law, Health Policy and Disability Center.

On today's call we have participants from the Department of Labor and Social Security Administration’s jointly funded Disability Program Navigator initiative, along with the Department of Labor disability related projects, which include the Work Incentive Grants, Disability Employment Grantees, and the Technology Initiative for Individuals with Disabilities.

Each of the audio conference topic areas draws upon areas where many of you grantees are still in search of a better understanding of how you can connect with services to help job seekers with disabilities. The area of accessible and affordable housing was identified as one such area, and today's call represents the first time, at least in, that the Center has focused on this topic. So we are really happy to have today, as our guest presenter Jim Yates, who is going to take us through this presentation. He put together a PowerPoint, which was sent to you ahead of time. So those of you who will be at your computer can follow along on the PowerPoint as he goes through his presentation.

And with this I would like to introduce Jim and first tell you a little bit of background with him. Jim is an associate for the Housing and Homeless Team of the Technical Assistance Collaborative, also known as TAC, which is based in Boston, Massachusetts. TAC is a national nonprofit organization that works to achieve positive outcomes on behalf of people with disabilities, people who are homeless, and people with other special needs by providing state of the art information, capacity building and technical expertise.

Mr. Yates' focus is affordable housing for homeless people and people with disabilities. He works with nonprofit agencies to troubleshoot and evaluate supportive housing programs, assist local and state governments, develop and implement strategic plans to address the needs of vulnerable populations. He also provides customized training and information dissemination on housing programs and regulations.

Prior to joining TAC, Mr. Yates served as a housing development officer for the City of Boston's Department of the Neighborhood Development, and he has also been involved on Section 8 Project-based Assistance programs and the Section 8 Moderate Rehabilitation SRO program. As you can tell, he has a lot of expertise and background in housing. And as Sharon and I talked to him prior to this call, we said he has a big plate to fill, because this is the first time that we have addressed this topic. And he has done a wonderful job in his PowerPoint, trying to touch on the major topics. And he will also share with you, how you at your local and state level, can get involved in the housing project.

And with that, Jim, we would like to again welcome you and thank you for taking the time to share with us today. And I am going to turn the presentation over to you.

James Yates: Great. Thanks, Laura.

Good afternoon. I am happy to be here to discuss strategies to access affordable and accessible housing resource is for persons with disabilities in your state and community. In addition to my presentation, within the documents list that is available on your website, I have provided some web-based links and resources that may be helpful for you to get involved in your community. I will also mention some of these resources during my talk.

On slide two, if you are following along on the slides, I have laid out an agenda for my remarks.

First I will talk about housing affordable with persons with disabilities, to really set a context for the issues at hand and the difficulty for folks with very low incomes, who have a disability to find housing that, is affordable in their community.

Second I would like to discuss and give you an overview, and I stress overview, because I have a lot of programs to go through and I am trying to get through it in about 60 minutes. And discuss the major federal affordable housing programs, focusing on what they are, what they can be used for, what they create, and give you some strategies on how to access these resources in your community.

Third, I just want to talk about some other housing resources, not federal funding programs, but efforts that are going on in your community across the country, focusing on organizations, groups, coalitions, to really give you an idea of what is out there, what to look out for in terms of connecting to, in terms of trying to navigate and trying to find what is going on and what are the resources out there for affordable housing in your community.

Let us get started.

Each time I move to a slide, I will mention we are going to move to the next slide. Next slide.

On slide three, TAC and the Consortium for Citizens with Disabilities Housing Task Force, each, every two years publishes a study comparing SSI incomes with fair market rents. The last time we did the study was 2002. The link to this study is also available on the list of related document, if you want to read further. The comparison was done nationally by states, by MSA, and housing markets. So you can get some good data both nationally and also what is going on in community, in comparing how folks with SS, that are on SSI are having real trouble accessing or affording housing in their community.

What TAC found was the housing crisis for people with disability receiving SSI is worse than ever. Next we will go over, next slide. The results are quite startling. First off, disabled persons receiving SSI extremely low income, SSI Income equals just 18 percent of median income, nationally. A person receiving SSI will need to pay 105 percent of his or her income to afford a modest one bedroom on the market. So, that really hits home that there is not affordable housing on the market. There is a need for some type of government services. For a studio apartment, it is not much better; a person would need to pay 89 percent of his or her income. This is nationally. In some urban areas, where, where rents are extremely high, it is even worse. In some of the rural parts of the community, in rural parts of the county, it is not as bad, but it is still not affordable.

For the first time that TAC has done the study, there was not one housing market in the country, where a person receiving SSI could rent an apartment affordably. Affordably, we will get into that a little bit further, but that means, that a person would pay 30 percent of their income on rent and utilities. The income that SSI provides is equal to a real meager wage, approximately 3.43 an hour. The study also found that rent rose twice as fast as the SSI cost of living. The bottom line is the only way a disabled person can afford housing and to go bridge this affordability gap, is to access housing subsidies.

Next slide.

The need, here, here on this slide, the need for subsidy is spelled out again. If the affordability is defined as paying, and this is just not tax saying it or advocates saying it, it is the federal government, HUD says it, that affordability is define as paying no more than 30 to 40 percent of a person's income on housing. Then SSI recipients who pay, should pay only, should pay no more than $160 to $220 on housing. I do not think anyone on the call can find an apartment for $160 or $220 a month rent. So that really hits home the need for subsidized housing programs, such as the Section 8 Housing Choice Voucher Program.

Next slide. Next I will start, turn my attention to the federal affordable housing programs. These programs are broken down into two types. First housing subsidy programs that provide rent, or operating support to a project, or apartment that typically allows the tenant to pay between 30 to 40 percent of their income on rent. The other type is capital programs that provide resources to help fund capital development of affordable multifamily rental projects. Some of these programs provide either subsidy or capital funding. Some provide both.

On the subsidy side, I just want do review the programs that I will discuss in my presentation. First off, the largest federal housing program, the Housing Choice Voucher Program, or the Section 8 Program.

Next, public housing. Third, federally-owned HUD assisted housing. Next, I will talk about a targeted program for homeless individuals and families, the McKinney Homeless Assistance Programs.

Next, Section 811 Supportive Housing, which targets housing specifically for persons with disabilities.

Capital programs include, the Consolidated Plan Programs of HUD on borrowed, these programs provide block grants through the HOME Program, the Community Development Block Grant Program, the Housing for People with Aids Program, or HOPWA, or the Emergency Shelter Grant Program. Also the Low-Income Housing Tax Credit Program, it provides tax credits, that developers can use to raise equity to fund the development of affordable rental housing.

To learn more about these programs and resources, go to the related documents list, and review a publication or guide that TAC put together, about a year back, regional housing forum, a technical assistance guide for housing resources and strategy. It is very helpful and goes into depth about these programs.

Next, I am going to move on to talking about giving you an overview of each of these programs, and giving some strategies on how to access these resources for people with disabilities in your community. Next slide.

First off the Housing Choice Voucher Program, a Section 8 Program, is the largest housing program, which I mentioned. It is funded approximately 8 million dollars a year. Recently the program has received a bit of scrutiny from the administration folks, you might have heard of it being in danger of block granting, other proposals by the administration. And the proposal, I think message that TAC and I would like to send you, the program may change, it may be administered differently, but it will still be a major program. And it is very important to access when you are serving people with disabilities.

Just to give you some overview of the program, 2600 PHAs (Public Housing Agency) nationally administer Section 8 Program. The program is really, is nearly available in every locality from either state PHA, a regional PHA, or a local PHA. The program provides participant with a rent subsidy to identify a program in the local market. The subsidy amount is based on the household's income and the cost of housing in the local market. Typically the participant will pay between 30 and 40 percent of their income on rent. The PHA will pay the difference between the established rent and the tenant's rent share.

During the past few years, many PHAs have had a poor success rate in using their vouchers. HUD has implemented a policy pushing PHAs to use it or lose it. This gives an opportunity to partner with PHAs, because they are looking at finding eligible folks to use these subsidies. In addition, PHAs that do not have a high utilization rate, which is defined as 97 percent or greater, are not eligible to apply for new vouchers. To be clear, the utilization rate is the percentage of vouchers that the PHAs have under lease, or that PHA has under lease.

Since 1997, and this is kind of an out, upshot of the Section 8 Program, but it is administered exactly like a Section 8 Voucher, but it is targeted to specif, to people with disability. HUD has issued over 60,000 new vouchers, which are targeted to persons with disabilities within three programs, the Mainstream Program, the certain developments program, and the designated housing program.

Providers assisting persons with disabilities need to be aware of these targeted resources in the community. If your PHA has these targeted resources, they have to be used for people with disabilities through the whole term of the rental contract, and not just on initial rent up or initial administration of the voucher. So if a person, if a voucher comes available, that needs to be given to a person with disabilities again.

There are over 470 PHAs who have target the disability vouchers throughout the country. In your local, if your local PHA does not have these vouchers, you should encourage them to apply for the mainstream voucher program, which is competitively administered or selected by HUD each year through the Super NOFA process or a notice of funding availability. We will discuss that later in the discussion.

Providers may also be able to partner with PHAs to provide services to support the housing effort. Nonprofits with housing experience, and this is a key point, not just PHAs, may also apply for these mainstream vouchers. These vouchers, as I mentioned before, operate the same as the Section 8 Program, but they must be used for persons with disabilities. It is a good resource to be aware of on the list of related documents. TAC maintains a list of targeted vouchers and what organizations have these vouchers, and it is located on TAC's website and you can get that link on the related documents.

Next slide please.

Next, I would like to talk about some of the benefits of the Section 8 Program and it is clear. First it provides choice in housing, a person can really move around and find an apartment that they want to live in. Next, the assistance is permanent and affordable. Third, the housing assistance is independent, that is, it can be linked, but is not separate from services and support. Services cannot be a condition of receiving Section 8 assistance.

Next. How does the Section 8 Program actually work? Some key points to consider and to remember. First off, the household applies to get on a PHA waiting list. Sometimes PHA waiting lists are closed, but open up from time to time. It is important to establish a good working relationship with your PHA, with your local PHA, and your state PHA, so you will be notified when the list is opened. This is important, so you can get your folks referred and get on the list as soon as possible. It is really up to the PHA how they manage their list, whether it is a first-come/first serve basis or whether it is by a lottery. You can find that out within the PHA plan and the Section 8 Administrative Plan that the PHA needs to publish. That really spells out the policies on how the PHA operates their program.

Once selected the person or household is issued a voucher to use in the local rental market. The person then has a 60 to 120 days to search for housing that meets the Section 8 requirements. PHAs, and this is important, especially in tight rental markets, PHAs can issue extensions to give folks more time to look for an appropriate apt.

Section 8 requirements include that the rent and the landlord charging must be within the fair market rents established by HUD in the local area. The rent must be reasonable to the local unassisted market. The apartment must pass a housing quality inspection, which is basically a sanitary, making sure it is a safe, quality apartment. And the landlord, finally, must accept the Section 8 payment and must agree to that.

Next, PHA subsidies are paid directly to the landlord. The tenant also pays his or her share of the rent to the landlord.

Next. Here is some other Section 8 rules that are important.

As mentioned before, a person pays 30 to 40 percent of their income on rent. Tenants may pay more than 40 percent only, and this is a key point, only if required by a rent increase. It cannot be over 40 percent at initial rent up.

The voucher is portable. That is, when the tenant, tenant has the ability to move. The tenant also, if the tenant decides to move after being in an apt for a while and wants to move to a different community, or move to a different part of town, or just to a different apartment, he or she or the household, the family can. The voucher is also portable anywhere in the United States and can be transferred to another PHA for administration. The PHA may restrict portability during the first year tenancy, but after that the voucher is fully portable.

Next, this is an important point. PHAs must target 75 percent of their vouchers to extremely low-income households, which are below 30 percent of median. This is really important for folks, disabled folks that receiving SSI, who make 18 percent of median. This targeting will favor their access to the Section 8 Program. Advocates and providers should also be aware that PHAs may seek an exception to this rule from HUD. So it is important to read the HUD Administrative Plan, and I mean the PHA plan and the Section 8 Administrative Plan to find out how the PHA is running their Section 8 Program.

Next slide.

I want to note that one very, very valuable resource that TAC has published, it is called Section 8 Made Simple, and it provides very, very detailed discussion of the Section 8 Housing Choice Voucher Program, and also strategies for folks with disabilities to access the program and to use the program better. That handbook is available on TAC’s website and the link is available on the list of related documents.

Moving on to the next slide.

There are two concepts that one should be understanding and be aware of that help persons with disabilities gain access to the Section 8 Program. The Section 504 Act on Accessibility developed these concepts in order for persons with disabilities to have equal access to the Section 8 Program, as well as other HUD programs.

First, it is the concept of Reasonable Accommodation. Reasonable Accommodation is a change in a rule, policy or practice, or service that may be necessary for a person with a disability to have an equal opportunity to the housing and to use the housing. PHAs must have a process or policy on how to request a Reasonable Accommodation. Persons with disabilities have a right to request Reasonable Accommodation to access or use the program. Typically requests are required to be made in writing. And a PHA then will review that request and determine if the request is reasonable. The PHA has no obligation to grant it. But it is very important, as a Navigator, and as a disability advocate, and a service provider, to be aware of this concept and to be aware of how your local PHA, how that Reasonable Accommodation policy is administered.

Tip, keep, on, on requesting a Reasonable Accommodation, if you are assisting a person, keep the request clear and specific to the accommodation request. An example of an accommodation would be a PHA allows a voucher to be used in a congregate living setting, like a group home, that a person would need to live in a congregate setting because of the person's disability.

Second, the next concept would be the concept of Reasonable Modification. This allows a person to alter their housing to meet the needs specific to a disability. A good example or Reasonable Modification is a person putting in a ramp or a walk in shower. There are some points to be aware of about Reasonable Modifications. Repairs must be done at the person's expense. It cannot be passed off to the landlord. The owners may also insist that the work be done professionally and done to code. The owner may also require the person to restore the unit to the original condition. It is a very balanced policy or concept. So it really, for folks with extremely low income, this appears, as you may know, or can infer, these are difficult to have done. Many communities as a result have set up modification funds to provide loans or grants to persons to make these changes.

Next slide.

Next I would like to give you some strategies on how to access the Section 8 Program. These strategies have been proven to be successful in many communities. These strategies cover every stage of the Section 8 process from outreach, application, waiting list management, all the way to housing search assistance.

Next slide first off, outreach. A PHA may as a result of accommodation, modify outreach practice or policies to improve access to persons with disabilities. Successful strategies include notifying the disability community and providers of the folks at the career center before opening the waiting list. So you can make sure that a person has the ability and the time to get to the PHA to apply. Also provide training on the application process to the disability community and providers.

Next.

Second, PHAs have, have or may as a Reasonable Accommodation, modify application practices or policies to improve access to persons with disabilities. Strategies have included, provide applications in alternative formats, for example, Braille or large print. Provide assistance to persons with disabilities in completing the application. Sometimes, commonly PHAs just have the family or the person put together the application themselves, but actually providing some individual attention and some assistance really does go a long way, or training providers to do that, is also another strategy. Allowing applications to be dropped off to the PHA, by friends, family, or advocates, if a person has a disability or physical disability, and is unable to come in to allow that to happen. Allowing completed applications to be mailed or faxed, another way to get the application on time to the PHA, without an undue burden on the person and family. Visiting the applicants home to complete the application. Allowing additional time for a person with a disability to prepare and submit an application.

Finally, allowing a secondary contract to be listed on the application. This is very important, because commonly PHAs as part of their waiting list management will, which the waiting list in a lot of urban areas can be quite large, in order to manage that and clean the list and update it, they will go over a process of notifying the waiting list that they need to actually get back to the PHA by a specific date, if a disabled person has been moving around, is difficult to get a hold of, having that second point of contact, whether it is a service provider, an advocate, or family member that can get a hold of that person, in order to keep that person's place on the waiting list, it is very important. And that is something that I would personally advocate to any PHA when you start having discussions and creating a dialogue with them.

Next, moving on.

Waiting list preferences. PHAs may establish waiting list preferences targeting access to persons with disabilities. Preferences may include: people with disabilities, people that are homeless, people in transitional housing, people receiving state funded supportive services, people with Medicaid Waivers, people receiving “Bridge” subsidy, that is a rental subsidy, typically funded at the state or local level, or people covered by the Olmstead decision. Also folks should keep in mind that these are local preferences. PHAs have the latitude to grant these. And this allows for persons that receive the preference to go higher on the list and, that housing voucher would be given to those persons over a family that did not receive the preference that was otherwise eligible for the Section 8 Program.

Folks that work with the disability community should be aware that PHAs are not allowed to provide a preference to a specific disability. For example, doing a preference for persons with a serious mental illness, or persons with, having mental retardation, or developmental disability. That is not allowed, because that actually discriminates against other classes of disabled persons.

Next slide.

Screening criteria. PHAs have some flexibility in modifying their screening criteria to improve access. HUD requires, and this is a requirement in statute, it requires a mandatory ban on assistance to persons convicted of manufacturing methamphetamine or registered sex offenders. There is no flexibility there. But any type of lower level criminal behavior, there is some flexibility on how they screen for that. As a Reasonable Accommodation, PHAs may take into consideration the severity of the crime, the evident of rehabilitation, and any mitigating circumstances. PHAs may also allow for extra time to gather documentation for verification and screening for persons with disabilities.

Next.

Set by the PHA, the payment standard, and this is an important concept or definition, determines what the PHA and the tenant will pay for rent. The PHA standard can be set between 90 and 110 percent of the fair market rents in the area. The FMR, or fair market rent, is set by HUD annually after conducting an extensive survey of unassisted units in the local market.

An exception payment standard and this is a key point, can be set for persons with disability as a Reasonable Accommodation. For example, there is tiers to this. PHAs first may provide, without any approval from HUD, an exception payment standard for a person with disability up to 110 percent of FMR. That is really to allow a person with the disability to find the right type of apartment that is maybe accessible, that provides some features, that is maybe located in a specific area, so a person can get to services they need. Next, PHAs may request an exception payment standard up to 120 percent of FMR from the HUD field office. Finally, PHAs may request an exception payment standard over 120 percent from HUD headquarters.

Moving on.

Voucher size. Here is another issue where there is some flexibility. Typically PHAs determine the voucher size, and this is, voucher size meaning a voucher for a one bedroom, or two bedroom, or three bedroom apt. They typically determine it by size of household. They take into consideration the person in the household, their sex and their age. Providers and disability advocates should be aware that the PHA has as a Reasonable and flexibility, as a Reasonable Accommodation; they may be able to provide a larger voucher size, i.e., a two bedroom instead of a one bedroom, to support either a live-in aid or significant medical equipment, if these services or equipment are needed to support their disability. In addition, PHAs may also have an exception utility allowance, a higher one, as a Reasonable Accommodation, if equipment causes the electrical costs to be higher than the norm.

Next.

Housing search assistance. PHAs as a Reasonable Accommodation, may modify housing search practices or policies to improve access. Strategies include providing extension or housing search over the 120 day threshold; assist applications in accessing support of services; identify funding sources for costs of modification, unit modifications; provide housing search assistance in identifying an appropriate apartment; providing a higher payment standard, which we talked about; providing technical assistance to owners on Reasonable Accommodation and Reasonable Modification, that is a very important point. Also you will probably, if you get involved with your PHA, you may find out that some of the PHAs in fact and the staff do not have a good grasp of what can and cannot be, what Reasonable Accommodation they can do or what they cannot do as a Reasonable Accommodation. It is really a question of education. I definitely use the Section 8 Made Simple book, in terms of helping education PHAs, it is a really good, useful tool.

This concludes the discussion of the Section 8 Program and Reasonable Accommodation. I am going to now move to other housing programs. I did spend a lot of time on Section 8 Program, because of its importance. On these other programs that I discussed earlier in the outline, the agenda, I am going to give you a real quick overview. And also give you strategies in how to access it in your community and where to find, where you can find, if these resources exist and how to identify them and get your folks involved in them.

Another housing resource that is controlled by a Public Housing Authority is your typical vanilla public housing. On resource to be available, TAC’s opening doors article, Number 22, there is a discussion of public housing authorities and different types of housing authorities that can be linked on the related documents.

The public housing serves extremely low income persons, below 30 percent of AMI and is subsidized, nationally approximately 550,000 studio or one bedroom units that are available to persons with disabilities. In the earlier '90s PHAs were allowed to convert some of these units to elderly only, because there were some problems with elders and young disabled persons living in the same complex. As a result, over 100,000 units have been converted to elderly only. This has really resulted in persons with disabilities losing access to, partial access to a valuable resource. Despite this policy, I would encourage folks to reach out to their local PHAs, to the public housing side of their Public Housing Authority, to see what public housing, in what complexes are available and units are available to persons with disabilities.

A directory of PHAs is located on the HUD website, HUD provides a data base. The related documents list provides the link to this PHA data base. That will give you an idea, that will actually give you links and identify the PHA that is in a community near you.

To apply for public housing, a person should contact the local PHA and get on the public housing waiting list. A key point that is there is a public housing waiting list and a Section 8 waiting list. Do not assume that, there are two separate lists, so when you are working with a person on housing, have them get on both, not just one or the other.

Next slide.

Publicly Owned HUD Assisted Housing. This is another resource that is very important and it is most, and is in most communities. This type of housing was developed probably in the '70s and '80s with HUD assistance. This housing serves typically extremely low income persons, under 30 percent of annual median income, and is subsidized by HUD, so it is very similar in some ways to public housing in terms of targeting. Nationally there are approximately 550,000 studio and one bedroom apartments available to persons with disabilities. Again, in the earlier '90s, property owners were, just like PHAs, were allowed to convert these units, to elderly only. As a result approximately 300,000 units have been converted. This result has resulted in a loss in access to resources.

HUD again maintains a data base of these projects. The related documents list contains the link to this data base. I would encourage, even though it is a shrinking resource, I would encourage you to reach out to these projects, if there are any in your community, and have your folks apply. They should contact the project directly or the management company to get on a waiting list if there is one.

Moving on.

Next the McKinney Homeless Assistance Program. HUD and Congress created the McKinney Programs to assist homeless persons in the late '80s. Many persons with disabilities are also homeless, as you know. McKinney resources fund three programs that can be used to create housing for homeless persons with a disability.

First off the supportive housing program. It can provide capital money, operating support, and/or services to create permanent housing. This is a very flexible resource for nonprofits, for governmental agencies to use to create housing.

Next, the Shelter Plus Care Program. This provides rental assistance, similar to Section 8 voucher program, in a tenant-based or project-based setting. This means that it is either a tenant-based voucher, where the voucher follows the person and a person can use in the local market, or a project-based setting where the subsidy is actually tied to a specific unit in a building and cannot move. The assistance is linked; this Shelter Plus Care assistance is linked to services that are provided to help persons be successful in the housing.

Third, the Section 8 Moderate Rehab SRO Program provides long term rental assistance to a project that provides single room occupancy housing. It is part of the Section 8 Program and PHAs must be involved as the administrating agent.

Nationally these McKinney funds create more than 10,000 new subsidies per year in addition to the subsidies already out there. Primarily these housing subsidies are funded by the Shelter Plus Care Program. I urge you to contact your local or state Continuum of Care. The Continuum of Care is a local homeless planning group. This group, each, most communities have a Continuum of Care group or at the state level, and they identify how these homeless resources are to be used. They are a good resource to contact when trying to identify where these programs are and how to get your folks involved in them.

Next.

HUD also administers a Section 811 Program, which is used to create housing exclusively for persons with disabilities. This is a targeted program and thus very important. There are two components. First off the tenant-based program which, again, provides the vouchers similar to the Section 8 Program targeted to persons with disabilities. This is called the Mainstream Program. We had talked about that earlier on, when we talked about targeted disability voucher programs.

Next. The other element or component is the project-based 811 Program. This provides both capital and operating subsidies to support the creation of rental projects dedicated specifically to persons with disabilities. HUD competitively awards both components each year through the Super NOFA or notice of funding availability competition. This competition is typically released by HUD in the spring. It is not out yet, we are hoping for it in the next couple weeks. Also McKinney funds are a part of the Super NOFA process.

1800 new units are created on an annual basis in addition to 2,010 and the based subsidies also created. Project-based, as I have mentioned, provide capital and operating, tenant provides targeted rentals, rental subsidies. HUD provides a data base of the 811 capital projects nationally. TAC provides a list of the agencies of PHAs that operate the targeted tenant-based subsidies. The related document lists has links to both, to both the TAC site and also the 811 data base. I would encourage you to find out about these resources and get the folks that you are working with on these waiting lists for the tenant-based subsidies, or at the housing project, specifically if it is an 811 project itself.

Moving on.

Next housing fed, other federal housing programs. I discussed the subsidy portions. Now I am going to focus on the capital side. There are two federal housing programs that primarily provide capital for the creation of affordable rental housing. First HUD developed a Consolidated Plan as a planning process for communities to organize their housing resources and efforts. The Consolidated Plan or a ConPlan oversees four HUD funding programs that can provide housing in your community. These are block grant and federal housing funds that provide a lot of flexibility for communities and states determine how to use them. Getting involved in the Consolidated Planning process really gets into influencing the planning process on the priority set and how to use them; so folks with disabilities get their fair share.

The four programs are, and I mentioned before, the HOME Program, which we will talk about in-depth, the Community Development Block Grant program, or CDBG, the Housing Opportunities for People With Aids program, or HOPWA, and the Emergency Shelter Grant program, ESG. The HOME Program is the largest and most important housing resource and thus we will focus a little bit of attention on it.

Second, the IRS operates and the Department of Treasury operates the Low Income Housing Tax Credit program. Tax credits and allocation of tax credits is provided to states, typically through State Housing Finance Agencies. They administer these tax credit resources, which support the development of affordable rental housing. States develop a Qualified Allocation Plan or QAP, which is the planning document or process that determines how the states will use and prioritize the use of these resources and what types of housing are created in the priorities set.

Next.

As we mentioned, the HUD comp link controls these programs: HOMES, CDBG, HOPWA, and ESG. States and entitlement communities, which under the CDBG Program, and/or participating jurisdictions under the HOME Program, cannot receive these funds, these block granted funds from HUD, unless they have a HUD approved ConPlan. The ConPlan process is important, it is important that you get involved. As an additional resource, I would urge you to take a look at tax, piecing it all together. This provides some useful information for disability advocates and service providers in how to get involved in the ConPlan process. The related documents list provides a link to that booklet or guide.

Next.

Here is a chart, it gives you a sample of the amount of Consolidated Plan resources going to some large cities across the country. This really underlines the importance of getting involved. There is quite a lot of money available, it does go to a lot of different sources, and there are a lot of different interest groups involved in getting their fair share. But folks with persons with disabilities, and providers, and advocates need to be at the table so they get their fair share.

Next.

I would like to focus now on the HOME Program and the relationship with the ConPlan. HOME is the largest federal block grant to state and local governments, used exclusively to create affordable housing for low income households. The use of HOME funds are prioritized and made available through the HUD mandated Consolidated Plan process. HOME funds are very flexible and give a lot of latitude to communities to respond to local needs. HOME funds can be used for rental housing, acquisition and rehab, new construction of rental housing, tenant-based rental assistance, very similar to a Section 8 Program type of program, home ownership activities, encouraging first-time home buyer activities, home buyer counseling, down payment assistance, activities like that.

Next slide.

How the program really works. Most HOME funds are spent on households above 30 percent of median, this is a key point. Typically HOME funds are targeted to, on home ownership 80 percent of median and below. For rental housing it is typically 50 or 60 percent of median or below. Again, if folks are on SSI, which we talked about, earn approximately 18 percent of median, there is that, there is a gap between projects created by HOME resources and projects that are affordable to persons with incomes at 18 percent and below.

In addition, half of HOME funds are spent on HOME ownership programs. This is not a requirement by HUD. This is what the local communities are doing with the money in determining priorities. So it is an upward battle, in terms of priorities, shifting priorities to maybe some rental housing development or some tenant-based rental assistance to serve folks with disabilities. But that is, so I urge you to get involved in what your community and state are doing and how they are using their HOME funds, and get involved, in terms of advocacy too, to change that, if there are folks with disabilities are not receiving assistance.

HOME funds support rental housing, and this rent housing typically will remain affordable for five to 20 years, depending on the circumstances. Most affordable rental housing developed with HOME funds is not affordable to the lowest income households, which we talked about. For example, one bedroom HOME rent in Phoenix is $500 a month. If a person can only afford $160 to $200 in rent, that person either is going to pay a large percentage of their income on rent, or they will not accept the apartment and will look for something else. Therefore, HOME, or a project supported with HOME, must be linked with either HUD McKinney-Vento programs, Section 8 vouchers, or some type of tenant-based rental assistance in order to ensure affordability. So you can reach down to 18 percent of median and provide that rental subsidy that only allows a person to pay 30 percent of their income for rent.

Next.

I did talk about getting involved, but here is some ways to get involved. Contact your community development officials in charge of the ConPlan, and that is your local city or state officials, community development officials, to learn more. They will have an annual schedule of when they need to submit their ConPlan to HUD, the amount of HOME funding or CDBG funding available at the state and local level. The Citizen Participation Plan requirements and the process for consultation with service providers, typically cities and states have public meetings and meetings in neighborhoods, have persons in organizations with the ability to provide written response and critique and comments. I urge you to get involved in any type of participation plan or community process. Get copies of the five year housing strategy, which is really the master planning document of the City's affordable housing efforts in the city or the state. And also their one year action plans, on what actually they are going to do with the money each year. Then the citizen participation plans and the performance plans. I am not going to spend a lot of time on this, but go back to the piecing it all together TAC manual that talks about the ConPlan process to learn more and that discusses these strategies in greater detail.

Next.

Moving on to the Low Income Housing Tax Credit program. Tax credits cover up to 40 percent of the rental housing development costs. That is a pretty significant percentage, and that is a very, very important program to be aware of. As mentioned before, the Qualified Allocation Plan determines how a state will use these tax credit resources. It will determine whether or not a state will do preferences for persons with disabilities, for persons who are homeless, or a set aside. These are, some states do, do this and have been a real big spur in the creation of supportive housing targeted to persons with disabilities or persons that are homeless. It is important to know if your state has these preferences, also what developers or nonprofits are using these preferences to create this housing.

Most affordable rental housing developer tax credits are not affordable to the lowest income household. Very similar to the HOME Program, the affordability ceiling is 60 percent of median. So the rents are set is the 60 percent of area median income. So there is that gap. Very similar to the HOME Program tax credit projects must be linked with had you had McKinney-Vento programs, Section 8 vouchers, or used with other types of tenant-based rental assistance to provide that affordability.

I would urge you to contact your local or your state housing finance authority to find out where these tax credit finance rental housing projects are located. Typically the HFAs will have a list or data base that folks can access, the related documents list has a link to a site that provides links to all the HFAs in the country.

Once you locate the tax credit projects in your areas, persons with disabilities should contact these buildings and the management company to get on the waiting list. This may, especially where there may be a lack of quality affordable rental housing, these tax credit projects that are fairly new, the program has only been going on for about 13 years, these are really a good resource that, for individuals that have a voucher, that just got a voucher off the Section 8 Program, to identify quality rental housing rather than just going to looking in the paper under rental housing, this may be another resource.

Next slide.

Finally, I want to spend a moment on other housing efforts in your community and this is not federal programs, but it is organizations, it is coalitions, it is other efforts going on, you may or may not be aware of. But I urge you to get involved, or if you are involved, to get more involved with it.

Efforts in organization include each state has an affordable housing coalition. These coalitions advocate for affordable housing at the local level and at the state level. Coalitions serve as a wealth of knowledge on what is out there and what is going around in the community in regards to affordable housing. I would recommend contacting your coalition to support their advocacy agenda and to see what they are doing for affordable housing for persons with disabilities. The National Low-Income Housing Coalition’s website provides links to these state coalitions. The list of related documents provides the link to the coalition’s site.

Most communities and states also have an active group of nonprofit community development corporations or CDCs. You make I have heard that term. Typically a large part of what CDCs do is to develop affordable housing to respond to local community neighborhood needs. Disability advocates and providers should reach out to these CDCs to understand what type of housing they are building, they are creating. They may also discuss ways to partner and access this housing for persons with disabilities. They may be opening, open to do an 811 project; they may be open to do some targeted affordability for persons with disabilities, as part of a larger tax credit project. But I urge you to link make relationships and make friendships with folks at the CDCs, because you do share some mission, they are both, you are both mission driven folks.

Refer to, again, refer to the Enterprise Foundation, the Local Initiative Support Corp, or the NRC, or the Neighborhood Reinvestment Corps websites. These are national affordable housing nonprofits. They provide a list of nonprofits or CDCs that may be active in your area. The list of related documents includes links to these, these three organizations.

HUD also funds local agencies to provide housing counseling services in every community, most communities. Services include: assistance in accessing rental housing, home buyer assistance, assistance with identifying housing resources, where affordable housing is in your area. HUD maintains a database of these agencies that provides these HUD funded housing counseling. The list of related documents includes a link to this data base.

Finally, there are a number of national nonprofits, which I mentioned a few before, LISC, NRC, the Enterprise Foundation, the Corporation of Supportive Housing, which provides, focus primarily in supportive housing for persons with disabilities and persons that are homeless, that support through technical assistance, through predevelopment funding, through capacity building activities, they support these local efforts to create affordable housing in your area. I urge you to find out if any of these agencies are active in your area. If so, contact them and discuss where they may be able to partner with disability groups to expand access to housing for persons with disabilities. The list of related documents provides a list and description of these national groups and a link to their websites.

Finally, just a broad suggestion, comment on advocacy, a disability advocacy. I urge you to partner, to partner, to partner with your disability advocates out there, not just if you are a mental health provider or a MRDD provider. Not just go with the other MR, not just go with the specific disability providers or groups that you typically work with on a day-to-day basis, but broaden your advocacy to across disability groups. Certainly strength is in numbers and whether it is talking to PHAs, or talking to your local community development office, or talking to your state, I think that that is how you, that is a better strategy and making an impact.

I have given you a lot of information in this presentation and you are probably overloaded. I want to, I wanted to give you as much as, as much tools as I could, in about an hour, on what housing resources are available and how to access them for persons with disabilities. And I also wanted to give you some helpful links to learn more. I urge you to take a look at the list of related documents. There is a lot of useful information out there, on the web, through those links, if you wanted to read some more about it, about affordable housing and what is out there.

Now I want to say thank you and I would like to turn it over to Laura and the Q and A.

Laura Farah: Thank you, Jim. First I want to again, as Jim was mentioning that his PowerPoint presentation, along with the supporting documents, they are posted to the LHPDC website. And the link to that is included in the e mail that we sent out regarding this topic today. And when you go to the LHPDC website, there is a section dedicated to the Disability Program Navigator and Work Incentive Grants.

This was wonderful, Jim. Before we open it up to questions and answers.

James Yates: Thank you.

Laura Farah: Not only did you take the time to share a lot in the PowerPoint, we really have some wonderful resources and reference materials that people can go to and can refer to and use within their One-Stop Centers and use with the mandated and non-mandated partners. So we really appreciate the presentation and then the additional documents.

And we are going to open the phone line up, James. So, if you can open it up for questions and answers.

Operator: Thank you. If you have a question at this time, please press the one key on your touch tone telephone. If your question has been answered or you wish to remove yourself from the queue, please press the pound key.

Our first question comes from Sheila Seacle, your question, please?

Female Participant: When I am working with a lot of individuals on benefits. Their fear is going to work and their rent increasing. So we talk a lot about the Earned Income Disregard program, or available through Section 8. And I know it is available through some of these other ones. Is it, in the other programs, you describe, do they have that same Earned Income Disregard rule or is it just the Section 8 housing?

James Yates: No I think it is just the Section 8 housing, because that is involved around the subsidy, the 811, I am not sure about the 811 program, but the HOME Program, the tax credit program, those are not subsidy programs, those are, the rents are set at either 60 percent median or 50 percent of median. And persons are eligible anywhere under that ceiling, but there may be more rent burden, as you get lower in affordability or lower income. So they really do need a subsidy to go along, to really access that housing.

Female Participant: We have, we had to do a lot of work with our local housing people, they were very patient with us and us with them, I guess, I am learning that rule. So you might just want to inform other people on the call about that rule, because I think it is very underutilized.

James Yates: I do not know if you can. I am not really well versed on that and how PHAs can use it. I know that it can be used within the Section 8 Program to really lower the tenant, or to lower the amount of money that the, in terms of the tenant rent calculation, lowering the amount of money the person needs to pay for rent.

Female Participant: Well, what it is, is if an individual would go back to, if their income increases as a result of work, they have 12 months where that increase in income is disregarded. In other words, they do not count it for 12 months. And there is like a time frame in there, like 12 of 24 months or something like that. It gets a little bit more detailed. But that is really helpful for people who are afraid of, well, if I go to work and earned $500 a month; my rent is going to go up $300 a month. And then the next 12 months, they only count half of the increase of income, so that their rent does not do a dramatic jump. So actually they have got about 24 months there that they are not going to get that full increase in their rent.

James Yates: Yes.

Female Participant: If their income went up as a result of work. And that is available to people with disabilities. And I believe some of the TANF and other training programs can access that. I do not work with those programs very often, so I am not sure on those rules. Very helpful.

Operator: Thank you. Our next question comes from Deborah Smith. Your question, please.

Female Participant: You were talking about the Reasonable Accommodation under Section 504.

James Yates: Yes.

Female Participant: Section 504 Act. And I thought I heard you say that the PHA has no obligation to grant a renter's request for a Reasonable Accommodation. Did I miss understand that?

James Yates: They have to set a policy for Reasonable Accommodation, and then they have to analyze the request. And if they do not see it as reasonable, if they see it as not a reasonable request, they may offer something else as what they see as reasonable.

Female Participant: What determines?

James Yates: But they do not have an obligation to, in every case; grant a request by a person with disability. If you have a PHA that works with providers, and it is a reasonable request, they will certainly grant it. What we have seen that is PHAs are really unsure of how much latitude they have, in granting Reasonable Accommodation, and they are really looking for help.

The TAC Section 8 Made Simple Guide, is helpful, in terms of talking through the issues of working with your PHA around those issues.

Female Participant: Repeat that please?

James Yates: TAC has produced a Section 8 Made Simple; it is a very helpful…

Female Participant: Okay.

James Yates: guide. And it goes into a lot of depth around Reasonable Accommodation and some strategies, if PHAs are reluctant to grant something, maybe negotiating, working to negotiate as an advocate with the person with a disability to get something that they can see as reasonable. It can be almost a negotiation to find something that both sides can live with.

Female Participant: Okay. Thank you.

Sharon Brent: This is Sharon. Just to add to that piece. That would be a good place to create a bridge between the providers of service to people with disabilities and the PHAs to turn around and educate each other on what kinds of things are available and what kinds of things are needed. Both have missing obviously, based on this conversation, and we also know based on the PHAs missing information about folks with disabilities, is a way for you to create as part of a coalition even at a local level, those players at the table so that they can exchange knowledge. It is a great way to advocate on both sides.

James Yates: And really, and keep the advocacy as much as possible across disability.

Sharon Brent: Exactly.

Operator: Thank you. Our next question comes from Lynn Larsen Schlitz, your question please.

Female Participant: Hi, I am calming from Wausau, Wisconsin. And I have been working with a couple of gentlemen who have mental illness, and alcohol and drug related issues. Both were on the Section 8 housing list, came up on the list, but were required, as part of their treatment plan to be in a group home. The group home was a transition home, a two bedroom, that was previously Section 8 approved, but the local Section 8 agencies said that they cannot fund them under those certain circumstances. And if I understand you correctly, that perhaps could be an accommodation?

James Yates: It could be. There are some group-home stipulations on how a group home is run. And I do not know, for example, the group-home has to be really operated like permanent housing, with separate leases with each tenant.

Female Participant: Okay.

James Yates: And so there is some, in the regulations, there needs to be, there needs to be, the PHA needs to require that from the group home. If the group home is going to fully congregate living, and the rent is not, and they do not have tenant landlord rights and they can be, you know, kicked out of the program at any time, it is run more as a transitional program, then that may be where the PHA is getting at, is that it is really not permanent housing.

Female Participant: Okay. And in this particular one would be permanent. But the other thing that I think the agency was somewhat confused on the group home itself was, how does the fair market value then figure into a two bedroom, when each bedroom is a facility in itself? Is fair market value then figured as two one bedrooms within a facility or are they two bedrooms? And does it always include the electricity and that kind of thing? Because the costs have gone just out of the ceiling for including, you know that, that component as well.

James Yates: That will have to be negotiated with the PHA, in terms of how they determine. There is some, there are some regulations under the special housing type portion of the housing choice voucher regulations, that go into group homes and how the rent is established.

Female Participant: Okay.

James Yates: And your other point was the utilities?

Female Participant: Right, yeah, utilities, because is not that supposed to be part of the Fair Market Rental Value, that utilities are included?

James Yates: No. Utilities, are, it is a utility allowance. Typically utilities are, well if the utilities are just part of the rent, then it has to be part of the EFMR or the payment standard of the PHA. But the, if, if a tenant actually pays utilities, that is where the utility allowance comes in. And that is typically set by the PHA; actually the utility allowance is set by HUD, at the local level, based on a survey of what utilities cost in that area. And that is subtracted over the tenant's share of the rent.

Female Participant: It is confusing, because on the HUD, the HUD website the Fair Market Values include utilities.

James Yates: Yes.

Female Participant: Yeah. And that is hard to tell, because utilities vary so much from house-to-house and area-to-area. So, thank you.

James Yates: Okay.

Operator: Our next question comes from Doug Keast. Your question please.

Male Participant: Hi. Thanks again, as everybody has said, on the great presentation. I think I understand it a lot better than what I did before.

James Yates: Oh, good.

Male Participant: The, I am thinking a little bit about that ConPlan process.

James Yates: Sure.

Male Participant: And approaching the community to talk about priorities. And I, I guess I kind of have about three different questions for you. And the first one is, do they track and record the percentage of people with disabilities that do receive the assistance through each of the PHAs?

And then secondly, I know that disability is not a homogenous population at all, but I know in the general population, when you look at incidence depending on what research you are looking at, it is somewhere between 10 and 20 percent of the population has a disability. But I would strongly speculate that people that are 30 percent of the median income level or below have a much higher level. There are many more people with disabilities in that population. And let us say hypothetically, and I do not know if there is any research that says that, let us say hypothetically it does point to 30 percent or greater. Is that maybe a reasonable basis to talk to your community, while you are working on the ConPlan process, as far as looking at what type of priorities should be reflected in their planning?

James Yates: Data is really, really a tough thing to try to find out there, in terms of linking housing and persons with disabilities. The Priced Out guide or study that we talked about earlier, is one of the few really that gets down to the local level. And I would definitely use Priced Out, when you are going to the ConPlan meeting or when you are meeting with your Public Housing Authority, because that actually, if you look in the back, there is all these tables and it goes down to the housing area. So you can say, in your housing area, you know, a person cannot afford this, or a person, you know, has to be, you know, it takes 70 percent of their income to afford a zero bedroom or things like that.

There are also taking a look at the census website. There is some, are some tables down to the local level, and at least the state level, on disability and poverty. It does not get into housing but it does get into above and below the poverty line, that may be helpful.

Sharon Brent: Also, just to add to that piece, you could also look at the SSA website. And they have statistical information. It goes all the way down to counties, in terms of who is on SSI, who is on SSI/SSDI, male/female, age range. So if you want to go dabbling onto the SSA site, that would be another place that you could get down to a county area within a state, to look at the numbers of people who might be on those kinds of benefits that determine disability.

James Yates: I mean, you would be surprised, in reviewing public housing plans and ConPlans, the majority of them do not, like casually discuss people with disabilities and move on in terms of need, in terms of defining need. They may have, you know, one statistics from the census and just move on. And that is, that is where really the disability advocate community comes in, in terms of informing, beefing up that piece. Not just on what they know anecdotally, but what they know through data.

In terms of tracking, you mentioned PHA and then you mentioned ConPlan. The PHA does track who they are serving, in terms of who they are giving Section 8 vouchers to, and also who is on waiting list, how many people on disability, is on their waiting list? They should have a good sense of who is disabled and who is not, both on the waiting list and also in receiving Section 8 assistance. In terms of need, that is another story. And you should try to work to inform them.

On the ConPlan, they may, they may, I think most of the ConPlan, there may be some requirements on disability, but I do not think there are as many, is, is mostly, it is mostly income, and demographics, and gender. Disability, in terms of reporting to HUD, in terms of, they may have anecdotally, in terms of what funds they have used for projects or activities, but other than that, I think that is the extent of it there. You will know just by looking at the ConPlan and the action plan by reading the projects. If 50 percent of the HOME funds are going to home ownership, you know that folks with disabilities are not receiving a lot of support.

Operator: Thank you. Again, if have you a question, please press the one key on your touch tone telephone.

Our next question comes from Patricia Gaines. Your question please.

Female Participant: Oh, hello.

James Yates: Hi.

Female Participant: I had a wonderful time listening to this presentation.

James Yates: Good. Thank you very much.

Female Participant: I am also from Iowa, where you heard from Doug Keast and Sheila Stokel, so we are very much interested in being more involved in the housing issues. I am in an area, though, where I am on a border state with Nebraska. But as far as state.

James Yates: You need to know both states, how they work.

Female Participant: Pardon me?

James Yates: You need to know how both states work.

Female Participant: Yes, yes. So that is what I am trying to work with, some agencies on both sides of the river. But my question is also about the plans and when they come about. You said that would be available on your website through the housing, the local county. Who again, where is the information located for the local plan?

James Yates: Local PHA plan, for the Public Housing Authority is available, sometimes it is available on the HUD website, but often it is not on the website. And I would go directly to the PHA and ask them for the plan.

Female Participant: Okay. And again.

James Yates: And for the ConPlan, for like your city, the city plan, or the Consolidated Plan, or the State Consolidated Plan, I would not go to HUD. I would just go directly to the Community Development Department that oversees either, they call them different, they call it the Entitlement Community or for the CDBG Program, and a participating jurisdiction for the HOME Program. Usually it is the city's or the large town's Community Development Office. And you want to go to them and ask them for their ConPlan. It is the same thing for the state. The State Department of Community Affairs. If you look up in the related documents list, there is in opening doors, Issue 22, September 2003, there is a discussion of state housing agencies. It really goes into a discussion of the difference between what a state housing finance authority is, or agency is, what a DCA is, or a Department of Community Affairs, and what types of programs do they typically administer, and also, how to get a hold of them. And what states, each state is organized a little differently, whether they have a state PHA or not. There is a guide in that actually, back of the article that really goes, actually goes by state and says whether or not each state, whether you have a state Department of Community Affairs, state housing finance authority, and a state Public Housing Authority, and also how to contact them. So I would definitely look at article, that Issue 22.

Female Participant: Okay. That is very good. And I did want to support the booklet that you put out. I did not know that was you. The Section 8 Made Simple. That is a wonderful guide.

James Yates: Thank you. I will tell the author.

Female Participant: Are you the author?

James Yates: No, no. Emily Cooper is.

Female Participant: Oh, well, I am go going to send her a note on that, because it was a wonderful guide to Section 8 and housing programs. And my director brought that back from a housing conference in Florida, homeless conference.

James Yates: Okay.

Female Participant: So, I wanted to make sure, though, that again, that we do involve our homeless facilities a lot more in this project, because they are doing a lot to look at housing.

James Yates: Yep.

Female Participant: For people.

James Yates: Yep. I think that was a policy academies.

Female Participant: Exactly. I wanted to ask, are you involving realtors and mortgage companies at all in this, some of the projects that you are working with?

James Yates: That is a good point. And I think that that is something. PHAs really have done a lot of work, because they need to find landlords, that will accept the Section 8 Program, you know, in their apartments, in their buildings. That is a big part of running a successful Section 8 Program, is landlord outreach to real estate agents, to property owners, to large apartment building owners, to really give them an understanding of what the Section 8 Program is. You know, owners really want to know, you know, is the rent going to be paid on time. You know,…

Female Participant: A concern is.

James Yates: You know, can I get a person, if a person is disabled, you know, where are the supportive services going to come from, those type of things.

Female Participant: Exactly. I understand. I am just saying the questions are there for them and we just need to help them in answering questions.

So, thanks an again for being a part of our presentation. I enjoyed it.

James Yates: Thank you.

Sharon Brent: Just to add to that piece, this is Sharon again. That is also where coalitions could come in at a state level or local level, is having multiple stakeholders, just like you identified, realtors and property managers, PHAs, all kinds of disability organizations, come to the table wearing obviously different hats, talking about that, and learning from each other, to figure out how they can work together to get the needs met of a community. And coalitions are very good at doing those kinds of things.

Operator: Thank you. At this time, I show no further questions.

Laura Farah: Okay, well this is Laura again, and it is about 4:30. So I guess it is time for us to close.

I want to remind everybody that our next audio conference will take place on May 20th, and it is on the Mental Health System. And again, on behalf of the Law, Health Policy and Disability Center, we really want to thank you, Jim, for taking the time to share with us today and to also put together the supporting documents. And to everybody, I want to say have a good afternoon. And we will talk to you soon.

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